Uncountable or countable?

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Chicken Sandwich

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Can you say: "Who still uses videotape?". In my opinion it's incorrect because you're speaking generally, so it should be: "Who still uses videotapes?" However, the Longman Dictionary of Contemporary English indicates that it can be both countable and uncountable:

vid‧e‧o‧tape 1 [FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot] / [FONT=&quot]ˈvɪdiəʊteɪp [/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot] $ [/FONT]-dioʊ- [/FONT][FONT=&quot]/ [/FONT][/FONT][FONT=&quot] noun [/FONT][FONT=&quot] [ uncountable and countable [FONT=&quot]] [/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] a video videotape of a videotape of everyday life in Havana

[/FONT]


Thank you in advance.
 

Raymott

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Can you say: "Who still uses videotape?". In my opinion it's incorrect because you're speaking generally, so it should be: "Who still uses videotapes?" However, the Longman Dictionary of Contemporary English indicates that it can be both countable and uncountable:

vid‧e‧o‧tape 1 [FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]/ [FONT=&quot]ˈvɪdiəʊteɪp [/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]$ [/FONT]-dioʊ- [/FONT][FONT=&quot]/ [/FONT][/FONT]noun [FONT=&quot][ uncountable and countable [FONT=&quot]] [/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]
a video videotape of a videotape of everyday life in Havana



Thank you in advance.
It's correct.
"Videotape" is the medium. - uncountable.
"A videotape" is a long strip of magnetized material in a cassette.
 
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White Hat

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That's probably because the word "tape" is both countable and uncountable:

a) We're going to need a blank tape to record the event. (a videocassette)
b) Police roped off the area with yellow tape after the incident. (the physical tape itself)

Check this out:

"A videotape is a recording of images and sounds on to magnetic tape as opposed to film stock or random access digital media. Videotapes are also used for storing scientific or medical data, such as the data produced by an electrocardiogram.(in the same article)
Videotape
is used in both video tape recorders (VTRs) or, more commonly and more recently, videocassette recorder (VCR) and camcorders. Tape is a linear method of storing information..."
 

Chicken Sandwich

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It's correct.
"Videotape" is the medium. - uncountable.
"A videotape" is along strip of magnetized material in a cassette.

Thanks. I think what I meant was the physical black object (videotape cassette). So if the person refers to the physical object as a whole ( http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fc/Vhs_cassette_bottom.jpg ), would it be correct to say "Who still uses videotape cassette?" as opposed to "Who still uses videotape cassettes?".

In this instance, I'm pretty certain that it should be plural.
 

White Hat

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If we say "Who still uses videotape?" without using any article, we'll most likely mean the band plus the container it's in - one complete unit in its entirety.
I don't think it's wrong to use "videotapes" here either. The original sentence drives the idea home well enough, though.
 

Chicken Sandwich

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If we say "Who still uses videotape?" without using any article, we'll most likely mean the band plus the container it's in - one complete unit in its entirety.
I don't think it's wrong to use "videotapes" here either. The original sentence drives the idea home well enough, though.

OK, thanks. The Concise Oxford English Dictionary says:

Videotape - noun: magnetic tape for recording and reproducing visual images and sound ==> a video cassette. (So a videotape can mean a video cassette as well?)

This is where I'm still confused. If videotape means the same as a video cassette, then in my opinion:

"Who still uses video cassettes?" and "Who still uses a video cassette" are correct, but "Who still uses video cassette" should be wrong.
However, I don't see why the same logic doesn't apply to "videotape", therefore, how can "Who still uses videotape?" be correct, if "videotape" is synonymous to "videocassette".
 

White Hat

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That's the thing - "cassette" is always countable. Therefore, an article should be used before it. But when it comes to "videotape", the word "tape" does the trick - there appears no need to use any article. The case itself is so much less important than the tape that it suffices to just say "videotape" with no article.
 

emsr2d2

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OK, thanks. The Concise Oxford English Dictionary says:

Videotape - noun: magnetic tape for recording and reproducing visual images and sound ==> a video cassette. (So a videotape can mean a video cassette as well?)

This is where I'm still confused. If videotape means the same as a video cassette, then in my opinion:

"Who still uses video cassettes?" and "Who still uses a video cassette" are correct, but "Who still uses video cassette" should be wrong.
However, I don't see why the same logic doesn't apply to "videotape", therefore, how can "Who still uses videotape?" be correct, if "videotape" is synonymous to "videocassette".

Let me see if I can explain the nuance!

Video cassette = countable noun referring to the physical black object
Videotape = two meanings: 1) the strip of magnetic tape held inside the object and 2) the medium by which some things are recorded/played back
Video tape = another name for "video cassette"

So you are right that:

- Who still uses video cassettes? = correct
- Who still uses (or who would still use) a video cassette? = correct
- Who still uses video cassette? = incorrect

But because videotape can be countable and uncountable, depending on whether you mean the object or the film medium:

Who still uses video tapes? = Correct (Who still uses those black plastic rectangles full of magnetic tape?)
Who still uses videotape? = Correct (Who still uses videotape as a filming medium, instead of using digital?)

Did that help? I'm not sure I explained it very well!
 

Chicken Sandwich

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Did that help? I'm not sure I explained it very well!

Thanks for clearing this up! I didn't even notice that "videotape" and "video tape" had different meanings.
 

White Hat

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Thanks for clearing this up! I didn't even notice that "videotape" and "video tape" had different meanings.

Do they really?

This academic source suggests using just "videotape" (as one word).
 

Chicken Sandwich

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SoothingDave

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I don't think anybody would ever say, in real life, "videotape cassette." It would just be a "videotape."

If you were thinking of the tapes (meaning the whole cassette) then you would consider it countable.

If you were thinking of the medium, then it is uncountable.

To me, the natural way to ask would be "Who still uses videotape?"

(And there is no difference between "video tape" and "videotape.")
 

SoothingDave

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Thanks for clearing this up! I didn't even notice that "videotape" and "video tape" had different meanings.

It doesn't. Forget about the space or lack of space in her writing and focus on the presence or lack of an "s" on the word. That was the point.
 

emsr2d2

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Maybe I'm imagining the difference in spelling but to my mind "a video tape" is a cassette, and "videotape" is a format and would not be preceded by an article. If it turns out that I'm alone in that belief, I will happily concede the point and never mention it again! ;-)
 

bhaisahab

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Maybe I'm imagining the difference in spelling but to my mind "a video tape" is a cassette, and "videotape" is a format and would not be preceded by an article. If it turns out that I'm alone in that belief, I will happily concede the point and never mention it again! ;-)
I agree with you.
 

Raymott

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OK, thanks. The Concise Oxford English Dictionary says:

Videotape - noun: magnetic tape for recording and reproducing visual images and sound ==> a video cassette. (So a videotape can mean a video cassette as well?)

This is where I'm still confused. If videotape means the same as a video cassette, then in my opinion:
Is that how COED defines "==>"? As equality?
I think it means something like "hence, or thus". It could even be a cross-reference.
I don't believe that COED would assert that videotape was a videocassette. Maybe you could check the front notes for us.
 

Chicken Sandwich

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That "==>" sign was supposed to be a solid arrow.

ENTRY STRUCTURE: CORE SENSE AND SUBSENSES
Within each part of speech the first definition given is the core sense. This
represents the typical, central, or ‘core’ meaning of the word in modern
standard English. The core meaning is not necessarily the oldest meaning, nor
is it always the most frequent meaning, because figurative and extended senses
are sometimes the most frequent. It is the meaning accepted by native speakers
as the one which is most established as literal and central.
Each word has at least one core sense, which acts as a gateway to other,
related subsenses. The relationship between core sense and subsense is
indicated in the dictionary entry by the placing of the subsenses immediately
after the core sense, introduced by a solid arrow symbol.
Many entries have
more than one core sense. Each new core sense is introduced by a bold sense
number, and each may have its own related subsense or subsenses.
 
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