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  1. #1
    Anewguest is offline Junior Member
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    Default The definite article before "President"

    Greetings. I'm really confused with the way the definite article is used with words like "president", "minister" etc. For example: "Mr X is the President of Humbalumba". (whatever ) and "President Mr X arrived in Tokyo yesterday." Why no article before "president" in the second example?

    Here's some more:

    "Mr Y, Deputy Chairman at Softworks, was absent today". Is this correct? I mean the bold part.

    and

    "The Deputy Chairman at Softworks Mr Y was absent today". Do I need the definite article here?
    Last edited by Anewguest; 09-Nov-2010 at 14:03.

  2. #2
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    5jj is offline VIP Member
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    Default Re: The definite article before "President"

    Quote Originally Posted by Anewguest View Post
    Greetings. I'm really confused with the way the definite article is used with words like "president", "minister" etc.
    Unfortunately some writers and speakers seem to observe no rules these days, which is unhelpful for learners. These are my thoughts:

    President Smith (of Xland) arrived today. title + name
    President Mr Smith arrived today.
    The President of Xland arrived today. title as person
    Mr Smith is (the) President of Xland. appears to be optional
    Mr Smith, (the) President of Xland, arrived today. apposition.

    Let's see what others think.
    Last edited by 5jj; 11-Nov-2010 at 14:22. Reason: typo

  3. #3
    Anewguest is offline Junior Member
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    Default Re: The definite article before "President"

    1 reply? Come on...

  4. #4
    TheParser is offline Key Member
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    Default Re: The definite article before "President"

    Quote Originally Posted by Anewguest View Post
    Greetings. I'm really confused with the way the definite article is used with words like "president", "minister" etc. For example: "Mr X is the President of Humbalumba". (whatever ) and "President Mr X arrived in Tokyo yesterday." Why no article before "president" in the second example?

    Here's some more:

    "Mr Y, Deputy Chairman at Softworks, was absent today". Is this correct? I mean the bold part.

    and

    "The Deputy Chairman at Softworks Mr Y was absent today". Do I need the definite article here?

    ********** NOT A TEACHER **********


    Anewguest,

    Well, here is my two cents' worth:

    (1) In the "old days," people had to write:

    John Doe, the president of Happy Land, will visit our country.

    ("the president of Happy Land" in apposition with "John Doe.")

    (2) Then "modern" journalism changed it to:

    The president of Happy Land, John Doe, will visit our country.

    (3) Then "really" modern journalism (such as our famed Time magazine)

    dropped the article in order to save more space on the page and also

    to make it into a title:

    President John Doe of Happy Land will visit our country.


    ********** NOT A TEACHER **********

  5. #5
    Anewguest is offline Junior Member
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    Default Re: The definite article before "President"

    Now that's what I'm talking about. And what about very modern grammars? What do they say about this simplification?

  6. #6
    TheParser is offline Key Member
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    Default Re: The definite article before "President"

    Quote Originally Posted by Anewguest View Post
    Now that's what I'm talking about. And what about very modern grammars? What do they say about this simplification?

    ********** NOT A TEACHER **********

    Anewguest,

    Thanks for your kind note.

    You've asked a great question, the answer to which I also am

    eager to learn.

    Hopefully, someone will enlighten us.

    ********** NOT A TEACHER **********

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