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  1. #1
    euncu's Avatar
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    Default Wi or wiθ. Which one is more common?

    I've got myself used to using "with" as wiθ but on tv or the internet I hear it mostly as wi. According to some dictionaries that I've consulted to, only the version with the voiceless th is correct. So I wonder if it is a BrE/AE thing or it changes from one person to other. I particularly welcome the answers of the members who are from different English-speaking countries, although it is not a must.

    Thanks for your answers in advance.

  2. #2
    5jj's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wi or wiθ. Which one is more common?

    John Wells's polls among native speakers showed:
    AmE: θ - 84%, - 16%;
    BrE: - 85%, θ - 15% (though in Scotland this rises to 82%)

    Wells, John(2008) Longman Pronunciation Dictionary (3rd edn), Harlow: PearsonLongman.

  3. #3
    euncu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wi or wiθ. Which one is more common?

    Quote Originally Posted by fivejedjon View Post
    John Wells's polls among native speakers showed:
    AmE: θ - 84%, - 16%;
    BrE: - 85%, θ - 15% (though in Scotland this rises to 82%)

    Wells, John(2008) Longman Pronunciation Dictionary (3rd edn), Harlow: PearsonLongman.
    I couldn't have expected something more precise than this one. Thank you very much.

  4. #4
    5jj's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wi or wiθ. Which one is more common?

    Quote Originally Posted by euncu View Post
    I couldn't have expected something more precise than this one. Thank you very much.
    That sort of information, very useful at times, is one of the reasons I recommend that book - 'Longman Pronouncing Dictionary' by J C Wells

  5. #5
    BobK's Avatar
    BobK is online now Harmless drudge
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    Default Re: Wi or wiθ. Which one is more common?

    Quote Originally Posted by fivejedjon View Post
    John Wells's polls among native speakers showed:
    AmE: θ - 84%, - 16%;
    BrE: - 85%, θ - 15% (though in Scotland this rises to 82%)

    Wells, John(2008) Longman Pronunciation Dictionary (3rd edn), Harlow: PearsonLongman.
    ...And what (if anything) does he say about 'without' and 'forthwith'/'withstand'/'notwithstanding? (Personally, I'd have difficulty saying /θ/ in the first or // in any of the others.)

    b

  6. #6
    5jj's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wi or wiθ. Which one is more common?

    Quote Originally Posted by BobK View Post
    ...And what (if anything) does he say about 'without' and 'forthwith'/'withstand'/'notwithstanding? (Personally, I'd have difficulty saying /θ/ in the first or // in any of the others.)
    Buy your own copy!............

    He doesn't give poll figures, but gives // as the first, /θ/ as the second in withal, withdraw, withhold, within, without, withstand, and notwithstanding; He reverses the order for the second th in forthwith. He makes no mention of AmE for any of these.

    Roach et al give both for with, noting 'The pronunciation with θ is most frequently found when followed by a voiceless consonant (e.g. 'with care)'.

    They give: withal (), within, without (, BrE, ,θ, AmE), withdraw, withhold (,θ), withstand (,θ, BrE; θ,, AmE), notwithstanding, forthwith (θ,)

    Roach, Peter, Hartman, James & Setter, Jane (2003 edn*) Cambridge English Pronouncing Dictionary, Cambridge: CUP
    *This edition is the 16th edition of Daniel Jones's English Pronouncing Dictionary, the second to be edited by Roach et al.

  7. #7
    birdeen's call is offline VIP Member
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    Default Re: Wi or wiθ. Which one is more common?

    I don't think I ever heard wi[θ]out!

  8. #8
    5jj's Avatar
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    Default Re: Wi or wiθ. Which one is more common?

    Quote Originally Posted by birdeen's call View Post
    I don't think I ever heard wi[θ]out!
    I don't think I have, but it's always possible that some speakers have said 'wi[θ]out', and I have assumed that I have heard 'wi[]out'.

  9. #9
    thatone is offline Member
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    Default Re: Wi or wiθ. Which one is more common?


  10. #10
    BobK's Avatar
    BobK is online now Harmless drudge
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    Default Re: Wi or wiθ. Which one is more common?

    Quote Originally Posted by fivejedjon View Post
    Buy your own copy!]
    Thanks. It's on the list!

    b

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