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  1. #11
    philo2009 is offline Key Member
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    Default Re: that (has) happened

    Quote Originally Posted by sitifan View Post
    At dinner time, Ioften enjoy telling Mom everything that has happened at school.
    Unless you live with your mother at the school, you are hardly likely to say this!

    The simple past tense, to refer to a part of the day that has (presumably) finished - i.e. the part spent at school - is the only appropriate choice.

  2. #12
    JohnParis's Avatar
    JohnParis is offline Senior Member
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    Default Re: that (has) happened

    Quote Originally Posted by philo2009 View Post
    Unless you live with your mother at the school, you are hardly likely to say this!
    I am definitely missing something (which is par for the course these days). Please tell me how "At dinner time, I often enjoy telling Mom everything that has happened at school" would indicate that "you" are living with your mother at the school? I can't see it.
    Thanks in advance, John

  3. #13
    bhaisahab's Avatar
    bhaisahab is offline Moderator
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    Default Re: that (has) happened

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnParis View Post
    I am definitely missing something (which is par for the course these days). Please tell me how "At dinner time, I often enjoy telling Mom everything that has happened at school" would indicate that "you" are living with your mother at the school? I can't see it.
    Thanks in advance, John
    You are not alone. I can't see how it would necessarily mean that.

  4. #14
    BobSmith is offline Senior Member
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    Default Re: that (has) happened

    Quote Originally Posted by sitifan View Post
    Did you mean to say that the term 'queer" lately has been reclaimed by the gay community?
    What on earth does "reclaim a term" mean?
    [Not a teacher]

    Does this help?
    Question: What do you call Deaf people?
    Answer: Deaf. Period. End of sentence.
    Not: Deaf and dumb.
    Not: Hearing impaired.
    Not: Deaf mute.
    (Update: The term "Deaf Mute" is actively being "reclaimed" by segments of the Deaf Community, similar to how the word "queer" has been "reclaimed" by the "gay community." Until you are "very" familiar with the community though you would be well advised to stick with simply using the term "Deaf.") - from American Sign Language: Terminology

  5. #15
    philo2009 is offline Key Member
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    Default Re: that (has) happened

    Quote Originally Posted by bhaisahab View Post
    You are not alone. I can't see how it would necessarily mean that.
    The present perfect naturally implies connection between a past event and present circmstances, a connection that may take many forms, one of which is a connection of place. Thus the question

    What has happened at school today?

    would naturally be taken to imply that the addressee was still present at the location mentioned (i.e. the school) at the time that the question was posed.

    Since, however, in the situation cited - that of a conversation over dinner - we may reasonably presume both parties to be present at the same place (and not indulging in some kind of simultaneous "tele-meal"), the only conclusion to be drawn would be that both the speaker and his mother are taking their evening meal at the school.

    Further, since a school is a place of education rather than a kind of restaurant, the only likely reason for that scenario would be if the speaker and his mother actually lived there.

    Elementary, my dear Watson!

    (N.B. It should be borne in mind that this is not an issue of grammar at all, but simply one of sense. We are attempting to determine, not what would be the grammatically "correct" tense to use, but simply that which would be most appropriate to the situation.)

  6. #16
    JohnParis's Avatar
    JohnParis is offline Senior Member
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    Default Re: that (has) happened


    "...would naturally be taken to imply that the addressee was still present at the location mentioned (i.e. the school..."

    "...the only conclusion to be drawn would be that both the speaker and his mother are taking their evening meal at the school."

    "...the only likely reason for that scenario would be if the speaker and his mother actually lived there."

    "Elementary, my dear Watson!"


    "...this is not an issue of grammar at all, but simply one of sense."

    Dear Sherlock,
    I respectfully disagree with the statements above.
    I believe that our job is to answer the question raised in the original post and I think that task has been accomplished several times over.

    John

  7. #17
    philo2009 is offline Key Member
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    Default Re: that (has) happened

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnParis View Post
    Dear Sherlock,
    I respectfully disagree with the statements above.
    I believe that our job is to answer the question raised in the original post and I think that task has been accomplished several times over.

    John
    As you wish.

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