Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 14
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Other
      • Native Language:
      • Russian
      • Home Country:
      • Russian Federation
      • Current Location:
      • Ukraine

    • Join Date: Oct 2010
    • Posts: 995
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #1

    have / having champagne brought to our room

    Hello,

    I wonder if this is a good test question:

    John, why donít you come and celebrate with us? We are having / have champagne brought up to our room specially.

    Is it possible to see the second sentence as "we have champagne [which has been/was] brought to our room", 'brought' being a participle rather than part of the causative construction?

    Thank you!

  1. bhaisahab's Avatar
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Retired English Teacher
      • Native Language:
      • British English
      • Home Country:
      • England
      • Current Location:
      • England

    • Join Date: Apr 2008
    • Posts: 23,083
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #2

    Re: have / having champagne brought to our room

    Quote Originally Posted by Verona_82 View Post
    Hello,

    I wonder if this is a good test question:

    John, why don’t you come and celebrate with us? We are having / have champagne brought up to our room specially.

    Is it possible to see the second sentence as "we have champagne [which has been/was] brought to our room", 'brought' being a participle rather than part of the causative construction?

    Thank you!
    Only "are having" is correct.

    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Other
      • Native Language:
      • Russian
      • Home Country:
      • Russian Federation
      • Current Location:
      • Ukraine

    • Join Date: Oct 2010
    • Posts: 995
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #3

    Re: have / having champagne brought to our room

    Thanks. Could you please tell me why we can't see 'brought' as a participle?

  2. bhaisahab's Avatar
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Retired English Teacher
      • Native Language:
      • British English
      • Home Country:
      • England
      • Current Location:
      • England

    • Join Date: Apr 2008
    • Posts: 23,083
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #4

    Re: have / having champagne brought to our room

    Quote Originally Posted by Verona_82 View Post
    Thanks. Could you please tell me why we can't see 'brought' as a participle?
    You could say "we are having champagne brought", we have had champagne brought", "champagne was brought". If your question is constructed appropriately. With this "John, why don’t you come and celebrate with us? We are having / have champagne brought up to our room specially." only "we are having" is possible.

  3. BobK's Avatar
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • English Teacher
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • UK
      • Current Location:
      • UK

    • Join Date: Jul 2006
    • Posts: 15,854
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #5

    Re: have / having champagne brought to our room

    You just can't [this was, you'll have guessed. a response to the OP] here. In the context of the 'having', the sentence is understood as causative.

    You could make 'brought' a participle by breaking the tie between have and brought:

    John, why don’t you come and celebrate with us? We have champagne; it was brought up to our room specially.

    b

    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Other
      • Native Language:
      • Russian
      • Home Country:
      • Russian Federation
      • Current Location:
      • Ukraine

    • Join Date: Oct 2010
    • Posts: 995
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #6

    Re: have / having champagne brought to our room

    I see. But why do I have to break the tie? What about

    -You told me you're interested in art. Why don't you come round tonight? I have a picture [which was] painted by some famous artist - forgot his name.

  4. 5jj's Avatar
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Retired English Teacher
      • Native Language:
      • British English
      • Home Country:
      • England
      • Current Location:
      • Czech Republic

    • Join Date: Oct 2010
    • Posts: 28,167
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #7

    Re: have / having champagne brought to our room

    Quote Originally Posted by TheParser View Post
    You: We have champagne brought to our room every day.
    That works, but it's causative HAVE again, as in the original 'we are having champagne brought specially'.

  5. Barb_D's Avatar
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Other
      • Native Language:
      • American English
      • Home Country:
      • United States
      • Current Location:
      • United States

    • Join Date: Mar 2007
    • Posts: 17,569
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #8

    Re: have / having champagne brought to our room

    Quote Originally Posted by Verona_82 View Post
    I have a picture [which was] painted by some famous artist - forgot his name.
    That "have" is the have of possession, not causation.
    I'm not a teacher, but I write for a living. Please don't ask me about 2nd conditionals, but I'm a safe bet for what reads well in (American) English.

  6. BobK's Avatar
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • English Teacher
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • UK
      • Current Location:
      • UK

    • Join Date: Jul 2006
    • Posts: 15,854
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #9

    Re: have / having champagne brought to our room

    It's all a question of context. 'Have', followed immediately by 'painted by...' is possessive (though in 'I have painted tha kitchen' it's not) . In this case, the expectations of the hearer work the other way. If you want to make it causative you can say 'I'm having a copy of a Modigliani painted by an artist friend of mine.'

    b

  7. 5jj's Avatar
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Retired English Teacher
      • Native Language:
      • British English
      • Home Country:
      • England
      • Current Location:
      • Czech Republic

    • Join Date: Oct 2010
    • Posts: 28,167
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #10

    Re: have / having champagne brought to our room

    Quote Originally Posted by Barb_D View Post
    That "have" is the have of possession, not causation.
    This would suggest that it's possible to interpret HAVE in this way in Verona's We have champagne brought up to our room specially.

    I think it is possible.

Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Champagne can wait
    By romelpanzer in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 30-Apr-2010, 17:05
  2. Dressing room/changing room or locker room?
    By sambistapt in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 09-Jan-2009, 23:53
  3. lumber room/storage room/stowage..
    By ripley in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 17-Nov-2008, 19:19
  4. Room by room wallpaper?
    By Tangerine in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 30-May-2008, 13:07
  5. brought on
    By Carmenn in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 23-Aug-2007, 19:57

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •