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  1. #1
    pinkie9 is offline Member
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    Default Sigining memoranda on provision of ABC's products and delivery of the products

    Sigining memoranda on provision of ABC's products and delivery of the products

    The above is the title of a document that describes two things. One is signing procedures for memoranda on provision of products of a company called ABC (to another company). The other is procedures for delivery of the products.

    Q1: Should I say "Signature on" instead of "Signing"?

    Q2: Should I say "delivering" because I used "ing" for "Signing"? Is it necessary to match the form of two verbs, "sign" and "deliver"?

  2. #2
    mayita1usa's Avatar
    mayita1usa is offline Member
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    Default Re: Sigining memoranda on provision of ABC's products and delivery of the products

    Quote Originally Posted by pinkie9 View Post
    Sigining memoranda on provision of ABC's products and delivery of the products"?
    First of all, be sure to spell "signing" correctly! Also, memoranda is plural; memorandum is singular. How many memoranda are we talking about?

    The above is the title of a document that describes two things. One is signing procedures for memoranda on provision of products of a company called ABC (to another company). The other is procedures for delivery of the products.

    Q1: Should I say "Signature on" instead of "Signing"?
    No. In fact, I think "signing memorandum" is a standard business term.

    Q2: Should I say "delivering" because I used "ing" for "Signing"? Is it necessary to match the form of two verbs, "sign" and "deliver"?
    No, these two words are grammatically unrelated (see above: signing is an adjective). If you separate out the two things that the document refers to, it becomes easier:
    - Signing memorandum on provision of ABC's products and [signing memorandum on] delivery of the products.

    One last thing: If there are two (2) memoranda, then you should probably say:
    - Signing memoranda on provision of ABC's products and on delivery of the products.

  3. #3
    pinkie9 is offline Member
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    Default Re: Sigining memoranda on provision of ABC's products and delivery of the products

    Thank you for answering my question, but there seems to be a misundertanding.

    Quote Originally Posted by mayita1usa View Post
    Also, memoranda is plural; memorandum is singular. How many memoranda are we talking about?

    There are two memoranda. That's why I wrote "memoranda", not "memorandum". One is "Memorandum on provision of ABC's products" and the other is "Memorandum on handring of safety management information".

    Quote Originally Posted by mayita1usa View Post
    No, these two words are grammatically unrelated (see above: signing is an adjective). If you separate out the two things that the document refers to, it becomes easier:
    - Signing memorandum on provision of ABC's products and [signing memorandum on] delivery of the products.

    I want to make these two things (the act of signing and the act of delivering) parallel. This is the title of a document which describes about signing procedures and delivering procedures, NOT signing procedures on provision and on delivery.
    Also, I don't think "signing" is an adjective. I used it as a gerund.
    Do other native speakers agree "signing" is an adjective???

    Quote Originally Posted by mayita1usa View Post
    One last thing: If there are two (2) memoranda, then you should probably say:
    Quote Originally Posted by mayita1usa View Post
    - Signing memoranda on provision of ABC's products and on delivery of the products.

    There are two memoranda, but neither of them is not on delivery of the products.

  4. #4
    Raymott's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sigining memoranda on provision of ABC's products and delivery of the products

    Quote Originally Posted by pinkie9 View Post
    Signing memoranda on provision of ABC's products and delivery of the products

    The above is the title of a document that describes two things. One is signing procedures for memoranda on provision of products of a company called ABC (to another company). The other is procedures for delivery of the products.

    Q1: Should I say "Signature on" instead of "Signing"? No

    Q2: Should I say "delivering" because I used "ing" for "Signing"? Is it necessary to match the form of two verbs, "sign" and "deliver"? No
    I think your title is reasonable and grammatical. But it's ambiguous - it does suggest that "Signing of memoranda on the delivery of products" is included.
    You do have parallelism. Both 'signing' and 'delivery' are nouns. (Signing is a gerund noun).
    You could consider, "Signing of memoranda on ... " because that gives you the parallelism of "Signing of A and delivery of B" But the ambiguity remains, and you'll have to decide whether it's important, or whether the reader should know by context what you mean.
    Last edited by Raymott; 24-Apr-2013 at 13:25.

  5. #5
    pinkie9 is offline Member
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    Default Re: Sigining memoranda on provision of ABC's products and delivery of the products

    Thank you. Let me confirm just one more thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymott View Post
    Q1: Should I say "Signature on" instead of "Signing"? No
    Is it incorrect if I say "Signature on" instead of "Signing" here? "Signature" can mean the act of signing, can't it? (I ask this because I learned that "gift" can mean the act of giving in another thread: http://www.usingenglish.com/forum/as...form-give.html )
    If not, how can you tell the noun can mean the act or not?

  6. #6
    Raymott's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sigining memoranda on provision of ABC's products and delivery of the products

    Quote Originally Posted by pinkie9 View Post
    Thank you. Let me confirm just one more thing.



    Is it incorrect if I say "Signature on" instead of "Signing" here? "Signature" can mean the act of signing, can't it? (I ask this because I learned that "gift" can mean the act of giving in another thread: http://www.usingenglish.com/forum/as...form-give.html ) Ah yes, I remember.
    If not, how can you tell the noun can mean the act or not?
    I assume that this is heading of piece that explains about signing memoranda; it's about signing memoranda. You could say that it's about the signature on memoranda, but that's not the natural way of saying it. (An analogy: Q: Why not change 'delivery' to 'deliverance'? A: i. It's unnecessary. ii. It sounds unnatural).

    You can't always tell if a noun formed from a word can mean the act. Often there are a few nouns from the same word, and one is more natural than the others for various purposes. Naturally, a dictionary is a the best way to find out.

    v sign
    .

    signed, sign·ing, signs

    v.tr.1. To affix one's signature to.
    2. To write (one's signature).
    3. To approve or ratify (a document) by affixing a signature, seal, or other mark: sign a bill into law.

    signing - definition of signing by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

    If 'to sign' means 'to affix a signature', then "Signing memoranda" means "Affixing a signature to memoranda".

  7. #7
    BobK's Avatar
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    Default Re: Sigining memoranda on provision of ABC's products and delivery of the products

    - the OP seems fixated on the phrase 'signature on'. This phrase does occur, but in this context: 'signature [of some piece of paper] on [=at the time of] delivery'.

    b

    PS The structure '<noun> on<noun>' is common in phrases like 'cash on delivery' (sometimes abbreviated to 'COD'), 'printing on demand', 'payment on completion'...
    Last edited by BobK; 25-Apr-2013 at 11:07. Reason: Added PS

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Sigining memoranda on provision of ABC's products and delivery of the products

    I'm glad you all got this figured out! I just want to explain why I was so confused in the first place:

    The term "signing memorandum" is sometimes used in legal, governmental and financial contexts: "A signing memorandum outlines the documents signed or provided at signing, such as powers of attorney, minutes of board of directors' meetings, ..."

    In this case, the word "signing" is an adjective telling what kind of memorandum it is, and this is what I thought the OP was talking about.

    That being said, I still think the original title is extremely ambiguous and confusing. Using the OP's own words, I would title the document this way:

    Signing Procedures for Memoranda on Provision of Products and Procedures for Delivery of Products
    (This is following American rules for capitalization of titles; not sure if that's applicable.)
    Last edited by mayita1usa; 26-Apr-2013 at 19:29. Reason: add reference

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