[Grammar] congratulate + perfect gerund

[tyrp]

Hello everyone,
I've got a question concerning the use of the verb 'congratulate'.
1. Am I right in believing that it is not used when talking about smb's B'Day as it implies some achievement made (like a diploma paper defence or a good mark at the exam etc)? If so, what about name-days? I was taught the expression 'to congratulate smb on smb's name-day', is it the way to greet smb on such a day or is 'happy saint's / name-day' more popular?
2. Do we use the perfect or the indefinite gerund after it? Is A or B correct?
A He was congratulated on winning the race.
B He was congratulated on having won the race. (which is more logical to me)
3. One more question into the bargain. Just tell me - A, B or C?
А He prided himself on handling of a very difficult situation.
В He prided himself on handling a very difficult situation.
C He prided himself on having handled a very difficult situation.
Thanks in advance!

 

[Gillnetter]

Hello everyone,
I've got a question concerning the use of the verb 'congratulate'.
1. Am I right in believing that it is not used when talking about smb's B'Day as it implies some achievement made (like a diploma paper defence or a good mark at the exam etc)? If so, what about name-days? I was taught the expression 'to congratulate smb on smb's name-day', is it the way to greet smb on such a day or is 'happy saint's / name-day' more popular?
2. Do we use the perfect or the indefinite gerund after it? Is A or B correct?
A He was congratulated on winning the race.
B He was congratulated on having won the race. (which is more logical to me)
3. One more question into the bargain. Just tell me - A, B or C?
А He prided himself on handling of a very difficult situation.
В He prided himself on handling a very difficult situation.
C He prided himself on having handled a very difficult situation.
Thanks in advance!

No, you have a number of questions. I shall address the first one. In the US, some do say congratulations on a person's birthday. It is more common to say, "Happy Birthday". Going a bit further, since the question seems somehow related to a person's birth, I am not sure of what a "name-day" is.

 

[SoothingDave]

I guess if your name is Stephen, you would be greeted specially on St. Stephen's day.

We don't have this custom in the US.

 

[tyrp]

Thanks for your answers. Now I'll be most grateful to BE speakers and their opinion. What about the other questions?) I'm anxious to hear your answers.

 

[tom3m]

Thanks for your answers. Now I'll be most grateful to BE speakers and their opinion. What about the other questions?) I'm anxious to hear your answers.

NOT A TEACHER, NOT A NATIVE

I think it would be better if you put your questions in individual threads. You are more likely to receive a reply.
As for your second question, this dictionary entry should make it clear. congratulate verb - definition in British English Dictionary & Thesaurus - Cambridge Dictionary Online

 

[Jaskin]

hi,
Please note I'm not a teacher nor a native speaker;

[...]
1. Am I right in believing that it is not used when talking about smb's B'Day as it implies some achievement made (like a diploma paper defence or a good mark at the exam etc)?
If so, what about name-days?
I was taught the expression 'to congratulate smb on smb's name-day', is it the way to greet smb on such a day or is 'happy saint's / name-day' more popular?
[...]

Quite a few points that I might be able to address in your questions.

The name-days are't usually celebrated in the U.K.. it's just a matter of cultural differences.
Saint's days in UK could be understand as referring to National Days.
B'Day is just the day one was born on.

Congratulation is also an act of acknowledging that someone has an occasion to celebrate whether it is achievement made or not.
If someone say to you "happy Birth Day mate"; what one did was to congratulate you on your birthday.
He sent them his sincire congratulation on their marriage - what he did ? - he congratulated them on their marriage.
Cheers

 

[tyrp]

Thank you dear tom3m and Jaskin. However, your answers are a bit perplexing. The dictionary gives the following definition of 'congratulate': "to praise someone and say that you approve of or are pleased about a specialor unusual achievement:
I was just congratulating Ceri on winning/on having won her race."
So they do mention an achievement, which your B'Day is not As for the problem with name-day, I guess you are absolutely right, Jaskin, in mentioning the cultural difference and the absence of such personal celebration (which is no achievement either) in the UK.
Thank you both for your help.

 

[Raymott]

You must be young. A birthday is an achievement because it means that you have managed to survive the vicissitudes of life for another year. That seems at least as much reason for congratulations as getting married is.

 

[emsr2d2]

Generally, I wouldn't consider saying "Happy Birthday" to be congratulating someone. It is simply telling them that you know it is their birthday and that you hope they have a nice day. There are a couple of important birthdays which you might consider congratulating someone on. In the UK, turning 18 and then turning 21 are seen to be quite important.

I would congratulate someone on getting married, having a baby, passing their driving test, passing an exam, buying their first house and, in the right circumstances, getting divorced.

As the others said, we don't celebrate "name days" in the UK.

 

[SoothingDave]

I would not congratulate a bride on getting married. It gives the impression that she was less than desirable and that finding a man to marry her was some sort of accomplishment.

 

[5jj]

I would not congratulate a bride on getting married. It gives the impression that she was less than desirable and that finding a man to marry her was some sort of accomplishment.

Many years ago, I was told that it was appropriate to congratulate the groom, but not the bride., for that reason. Despite this, many people congratulate both bride and groom.

 

[SoothingDave]

Many years ago, I was told that it was appropriate to congratulate the groom, but not the bride., for that reason. Despite this, many people congratulate both bride and groom.

It's something my father told me once and it has a sort of logic to it. Perhaps a tad old fashioned or chauvinistic, but well-intentioned.

 

[Jaskin]

hi,
Please note I'm not a teacher nor a native speaker,

I'm still trying to learn that 'stuff' but I'll laid the logic behind what I wrote.

How can one make a reported speech out of : "emrsr2d2 : happy birthday 5jj";
I would go for "emrsr2d2 wished 5jj happy birthday" or perhaps: "ersr2d2 congratulated 5jj on his birthday";
and as for me the difference between the two statements is the same as between calling a house a building or construction.

The sense of congratulate (as express congratulations<-- wish <-- greet,recognize) IMHO is invoked upon the utterance: I wish you all the best; happy birthday; bid farewell

cheers

PS
Please note that the sense of congratulate I'm talking about doesn't necessary involve achievement;

 

[5jj]

How can one make a reported speech out of : "emrsr2d2 : happy birthday 5jj";
I would go for "emrsr2d2 wished 5jj happy birthday" or perhaps: "ersr2d2 congratulated 5jj on his birthday".

The first is correct and natural. The second is grammatically OK, but is not natural.

Not the spelling of emsr2d2.

 

[Jaskin]

hi,
Please note not a teacher nor a native speaker;

Not natural had been played and trumped grammar and logic.
Anyway could you please tell me if at least the semantic map is ok ?

Cheers

 

[5jj]

Not natural had been played and trumped grammar and logic.

I'm sorry, but I don't understand that

Anyway could you please tell me if at least the semantic map is ok ?

Perhaps I am having a bad day, but I don't understand that, either.

 

[emsr2d2]

I'm sorry, but I don't understand thatPerhaps I am having a bad day, but I don't understand that, either.

I didn't get any part of that post either.

Anyway, in reported speech I would say "EmsR2D2 wished 5jj a happy birthday".

 

[Jaskin]

hi,
Please note I'm not a teacher nor a native speaker.

I'm sorry but after pulling all-nighter it's more likely that it is me who is having the bad day.

Not natural had been played and trumped grammar and logic.
I tried to use an analogy to card playing.
Not natural (card) had been played : You said that my second sentence in reported speech was [...] not natural.
That is stronger argument (trumped) than mere syntactic accuracy (grammar) and the semantic relation (logic).
So it was a way of saying that the problem with the phrase not being natural was more important than its grammatical correction.

As to "Anyway could you please tell me if at least the semantic map is ok ?"
By the semantic map I meant the semantic relation (hypernymy) I hinted on illegibly in post #13

congratulate (as express congratulations<-- wish <-- greet,recognize)

congratulate (in the sense: express congratulations) is type of wish which is a type of greet,recognize.

Just started reading on semantics and pragmatics and the concept of semantic relations and I'm trying to use it to tackle some problems using that approach.

cheers;

 

[tyrp]

Dear SoothingDave, emsr2d2, Raymott and 5jj,
I am most grateful for your answers and help. Everything's become clear to me, but for the use of the type of gerund after 'congratulate on'. If you could possibly tackle that problem too, you'd make my day. Thanks again.

 

[tom3m]

Dear SoothingDave, emsr2d2, Raymott and 5jj,
I am most grateful for your answers and help. Everything's become clear to me, but for the use of the type of gerund after 'congratulate on'. If you could possibly tackle that problem too, you'd make my day. Thanks again.

NOT A TEACHER, NOT A NATIVE

If the part of your sentence in bold is referring about your original second question, I thought I had already given you the answer. I understand and acknowledge that it is undoubtedly better to have more responses than only one from someone who is not a native to boot. Despite that, I have searched a bit.

2. Do we use the perfect or the indefinite gerund after it? Is A or B correct?
A He was congratulated on winning the race.
B He was congratulated on having won the race. (which is more logical to me)

I still would stick to my first 'explanation', which was the link to the Cambridge Dictionary. Strictly grammatically, the dictionary should have answered what you had asked for - 'congratulate' is used with both perfect and continuous.
After that you wrote that the verb in the dictionary was used with a different meaning - achievements. Than Raymott added that in his opinion birthday is an achievement. This is a matter of opinion/age/definition etc. However, you question was about grammar. Also in your original question, there isn't 'birthday' but 'race'.
Here's a link to another dictionary that does not offer both alternatives, but the one that apparently seems less logical to you. congratulate - definition of congratulate by Macmillan Dictionary
In addition, Michal Swan in his Practical English Usage claims:congratulate/congratulations on something
I must congratulate you on your exam results.
Congratulations on your new job!
congratulate/congratulations on/for doing something
He congratulated the team on/for having won all their games.

As you can see 'for' can also be used instead of 'on'. I am not quite sure if this is always possible, since there is supposed to be a slight difference of meaning, but there is a fairly comprehensible explanation on this website so here's link in case you are interested: word choice - "Congratulate for" vs. "congratulate on" - English Language & Usage Stack Exchange
Perhaps, teachers may care to comment on it and clarify some things I failed to mention or didn't say correctly.