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    • Join Date: Oct 2003
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    #11

    Re: How would you define the future time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Casiopea
    What do you mean by "the" future time? If you mean "future time", I'd say it's non-past and non-present.
    Do you have examples that are non-past and non-present?

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    #12

    Re: How would you define the future time?

    I do, yes, but, first, could you give us a few examples of what this means, "the future time"? I'd like to know what it is that you see/understand when you read, "non-past and non-present".


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    #13

    Re: How would you define the future time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Casiopea
    I do, yes, but, first, could you give us a few examples of what this means, "the future time"? I'd like to know what it is that you see/understand when you read, "non-past and non-present".
    Do you mean I have misused "the"? If so, how would you define future time? If I can give examples myself, I don't need to ask, do I?


    • Join Date: Jun 2006
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    #14

    Re: How would you define the future time?

    I have a hard time in seeing what is the present time and what is the future time.

    Must tomorrow is a future time?
    What about next hour?
    What about next minute?
    What about next second?
    Are they all the future time?
    As some have already answered the next minute/second would be the future. If this time comes to be now, meaning something is taking place at, during or this exact minute you would consider this to be present. If the future minute were to come to be present, than the following minute after that would be considered future, because it will happen. Anything you consider beyond the current time that is taking place will be future.
    For instance; today, this week, at this hour, or this month even is the present, because you are within it. If you say next week, in two hours, or later on, this is the future; it will take place sometime. You need to specify if you are going to do this right now or later on.

    Hope this works in some kind of way, I often tend to confuse myself with my own writing.


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    #15

    Re: How would you define the future time?

    Thank you Incognittum,
    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    As some have already answered the next minute/second would be the future.
    The bad thing is, as I said, it follows that the present time can be only this millisecond. It doesn't make any sense to me.
    I therefore prefer your present time, which is much longer:
    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    For instance; today, this week, at this hour, or this month even is the present, because you are within it.
    However, I am afraid your present time contradicts your future time:
    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    If you say next week, in two hours, or later on, this is the future; it will take place sometime.
    If "today" is present time, how can it be that "in two hours" is the future time? Do you mean the future time is within the present time? How can it be possible that I am within "today", but outside "in two hours"? Is "in two hours" outside "today"? I don't understand.
    Or do you mean this "in two hours" sometimes won't take place? May you elaborate on this? Thank you very much.
    Last edited by shun; 03-Jul-2006 at 02:18.


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    #16

    Re: How would you define the future time?

    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    If you say; "Today I am playing a game" this refers to the present, because you are doing something at this moment (ing). If you say; "Tomorrow I will be playing a game" you are refering to the future, because it will happen eventually or sometime.

    I hope that you may stay on the subject that is on the difference between the present time and the future time.

    But it seems that you are now talking about the difference between the present action and the future action.

    ------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    Let's say, next week you will be going to school everyday. This refers to the future, because it will happen and here you are talking about the "whole week" in general.

    Again, what is "This", if it is not an action? I wholly agree that the action you say refers to the future. But our thread is talking about "the future" itself. Those readers who are before you haven't missed the point, which is about the future time, rather than the future action.

    What I want to say is, before we study "This refers to the future", we have to study what is the future first. I want to know what is the future, not the thing that refers to the future.

    Thank you very much.


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    #17

    Re: How would you define the future time?

    Since the previous readers asked what do you mean regarding your question, I do not think it qualifies as being aware of the your 'point'.

    Anyway, you could infer the meaning of time from what I have said about the future. It is a time or action that is away from the present and it did not happen yet, like the next millisecond, in an hour or must tomorrow as you have previously asked. You obviously have an idea of what the future is, and unless you ask the right question that can be answered, how can people understand what you mean. Do you require examples of word usage to express the future time? Like you have stated here:

    PHP Code:
    I have a hard time in seeing what is the present time and what is the future time.

    Must tomorrow is a future time?
    What about next hour?
    What about next minute?
    What about next second?
    Are they all the future time
    All of these are future time, because they have not come to be yet. Time is moving backwards while you can stand in place and wait for this time to come or move towards it. Pretend you're on a highway facing North and all the cars ( imagine the cars are the time) are moving South. You stand in place and await a car that is 10KM away, eventually the car will come to you. When you meet, that will be the present and when it passes you by, that will be the past. Or, that car is in place at 10KM away and you are moving towards it, you are moving in the present, you exist within that time, and that car is in the future, because you have not met yet. Once you meet it will become the present time and if you continue on that road and pass it, it instantly becomes the past. It depends on how you view the action that is supposed to happen. You can await the 'specific' millisecond which can be the next one after the one that is in the present time or it may be a minute away. You can refer to next week, which the whole week will be the future time that you are awaiting because something will keep happening during that week which will count as the present as soon as you are within that week. You must specify if the time you await is small or big like a minute or an hour. Everything that you await to happen is the future, it does not matter whether it is whitin the present day or the present week.

    PHP Code:
    If "today" is present timehow can it be that "in two hours" is the future time? Do you mean the future time is within the present timeHow can it be possible that I am within "today"but outside "in two hours"Is "in two hours" outside "today"I don't understand. 
    Or do you mean this "in two hours" sometimes won'
    t take placeMay you elaborate on thisThank you very much
    In previous post I have tried to explain that. Today is present time, it refers to the 'whole' day in general, you wanted this time to come, those 24 hours, and they did, so it is the present. If you are in time at 1400 hours and you are awating a delivery at 1600 then that is the future, because you are refering to a different time, something that did not happen yet. The day 'today' happened and it is the present, delivery did not come to be yet so it is the future.


    I was mistaken as to the answer that you have required, and the way I understand time, I have tried to put into words. If I still have not answered a part of your question and have been blubbing senslessly then I apologize for taking your time while reading. "While you are reading it is the present, the milliseconds and minutes can go by, they are not relevant. It's like you're on a highway and reached the car, you look at it, inspect it, when you continue on, that becomes the past and whatever lies ahead is future. When you finish reading it will become the past and when you go to post your own reply which did not happen yet, it is the future." You have to look at the time and realize the concept, figuratively apeaking. The right answer requires the right question, I have tried and learned. I am only human.
    Last edited by incognittum; 04-Jul-2006 at 15:19.


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    #18

    Re: How would you define the future time?

    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    Since the previous readers asked what do you mean regarding your question, I do not think it qualifies as being aware of the your 'point'.


    Oh, how convenient a logic here is! Your logic is, as my question was vague at the beginning, it must be still vague until now. A remarkable reasoning.

    As they have been discussing my question, they still didn't even know my 'point'? I would not hint that if I were you. The joke is more on them than on me.

    ----------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    Anyway, you could infer the meaning of time from what I have said about the future.


    Please, you have talked about the future action, not the future time. I cannot get the definition of the future time as you shift the whole thing to a future action.

    ----------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    You obviously have an idea of what the future is, and unless you ask the right question that can be answered, how can people understand what you mean.


    This extremely illogical riposte is stunning. When a student asks "How do we use Simple Present tense?", you may award to him or her the same wisdom, "You obviously have an idea of what the Simple Present tense is, and unless you ask the right question that can be answered, how can people understand what you mean. You ask in Simple Present tense, how comes you don't know the Simple Present tense?"

    -----------------
    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    All of these are future time, because they have not come to be yet.


    This is the point. I have found out that, if "all of these are future time", there will be no more room for present time. And this is illogical. Therefore I ask how to define future time, so that we may still have some present time left. May you have now got a little understanding why I ask the theme subject?

    I repeat: I now understand my definition in the past is not correct enough, so I ask for a new one. Is there an iota of reason you can see why I am asking the question now?

    --------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    Pretend you're on a highway facing North and all the cars ( imagine the cars are the time) are moving South. You stand in place and await a car that is 10KM away, eventually the car will come to you. When you meet, that will be the present and when it passes you by, that will be the past.


    Please, in this example there is not even the word 'future' here. A very bad example to define "future time".

    --------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    Or, that car is in place at 10KM away and you are moving towards it, you are moving in the present, you exist within that time, and that car is in the future, because you have not met yet.


    No, I am afraid I have to differ. At the present time, the car is in place at 10KM away and I am moving towards it. Both the car and I are at the present time. The car is NOT in the future. Now I have not met the car yet doesn't mean the car is in the future.

    Again, you are describing the present action and the future action. But I want to know how to define future time, so I have some present time left. Or will you portray that future time is when a car is in place at 10KM away form us?

    In your example, what about the car comes a little nearer, say 7KM away from me, what then is the present time and what is the future time? Or is it now a time between the present time and the future time?

    And later, when the car is nearer and in place at 4 KM away, again, what is the present time and what is the future time? Why must you call it future time just when the car meets my place?

    And then, when the car passes by me, in place at 25KM behind me, and I am walking away from the car, what then is the future time? And what is the present time?

    Can't you see heaps of actions can never explain the future time?


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    #19

    Re: How would you define the future time?

    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    In previous post I have tried to explain that. Today is present time, it refers to the 'whole' day in general, you wanted this time to come, those 24 hours, and they did, so it is the present. If you are in time at 1400 hours and you are awating a delivery at 1600 then that is the future, because you are refering to a different time, something that did not happen yet. The day 'today' happened and it is the present, delivery did not come to be yet so it is the future.


    The difficulty is still the same. Both 1400 and 1600 hours are within today. That is to say, the future time is within the present time. It doesn't make any sense to me. It does to you, maybe. Try the following dialogue:

    Dad: Aunt Lee visits us today.
    Son: No, she says she visit us in the future.
    Dad: No, she said "today".
    Son: No, she said "two o'clock this afternoon", so it is future.
    Dad: Where did you learn this? Two o'clock this afternoon is within today, so it is today, OK?

    This is my logic: part of the present time is still present time, agree? Today is present time, as you said. It follows that two o'clock this afternoon, which is within today, is still the present time. If not, where is your logic?

    ---------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    If I still have not answered a part of your question and have been blubbing senslessly then I apologize for taking your time while reading.


    Dear Incogittum, I truly thank you for your time and you did clarify what is exactly my problem. In the past, I thought I understood what is future time -- any time coming to present is future time. But I found out the definition has buried all my present time, so I ask for a new better definition for future time.

    Obviously, you want me to get the idea of the future time from a future action. But I fail to do so.

    You also want me to take a part of present time as the future time. But I also fail to do so. I stress that it is not your fault at all. It is my weakness not to accept that part of the present time is not the present time.

    "Two o'clock this afternoon" is part of today. As today is present time, so is "two o'clock this afternoon". Unless there is a better logic, my logic remains.

    Another logic of mine is, if "in two hours" is future time because it does not happen yet, it must follow that even the next second or the next millisecond is also future time. If so, I have no present time left.

    On the other hand, your logic is "that car is in place at 10KM away and you are moving towards it, you are moving in the present, you exist within that time, and that car is in the future, because you have not met yet". I find it ridiculous. You have not met me also, does it mean you exist at present and I am in the future? It doesn't make any sense to me. Unfortunately, you have mistaken here/there as present/future.


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    #20

    Re: How would you define the future time?

    Quote Originally Posted by incognittum
    If you are in time at 1400 hours and you are awating a delivery at 1600 then that is the future, because you are refering to a different time, something that did not happen yet. The day 'today' happened and it is the present, delivery did not come to be yet so it is the future.


    In this case, after the delivery at 1600 that is the future, we still have today that is the present. So the time flow is the future precedes the present. What kind of a logic it is?

    The time flow should have been past present future, not illogically past future present.

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