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  1. #1
    tangelatm is offline Junior Member
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    Question Troubling phrasal verbs and idioms

    Hi out there!
    Could you please tell me whether the following underlined verbs are phrasal verbs:
    1. He waited for his wife to come.(to wait for?
    2. Suddenly, the stranger stepped up to him.(to step up?)
    3. Lou went away without saying a word.(to go away?)
    4. Barbara walked away without making an excuse.(to walk away?)
    5. He got the moon back where it belonged.(to get sth. back?)
    6. Nassredin looked into the well.(to look into)
    7. She looked up into the sky.(to look up?)
    8. The boy ran into the house.(to run into?)
    9. The boys walked out across the fields.(to walk out?)
    10. The costumer came forward to attend the old man.(to come forward?)
    11. The father turned to his daughter and showed her the letter.(to turn to sb.?)
    12. I donít know where my face stops unless I keep my hat on.(to keep sth. on?)
    Are the following idioms:
    13. He was making his way very carefully.(to make one's way?)
    14. The hook came loose. (to come loose?)
    15. He found himself adrift in the middle of the ocean.(to find oneself somewhere/ +prep.?)
    I found the verbs in 1-12 in the Longman Dictionary of Phrasal Verbs, but according to most definitions of phrasal verbs they donít seem to be phrasal verbs proper.
    Thanks,
    Angela

  2. #2
    MikeNewYork's Avatar
    MikeNewYork is offline VIP Member
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    Re: Troubling phrasal verbs and idioms

    Quote Originally Posted by tangelatm View Post
    Hi out there!
    Could you please tell me whether the following underlined verbs are phrasal verbs:
    1. He waited for his wife to come.(to wait for?
    2. Suddenly, the stranger stepped up to him.(to step up?)
    3. Lou went away without saying a word.(to go away?)
    4. Barbara walked away without making an excuse.(to walk away?)
    5. He got the moon back where it belonged.(to get sth. back?)
    6. Nassredin looked into the well.(to look into)
    7. She looked up into the sky.(to look up?)
    8. The boy ran into the house.(to run into?)
    9. The boys walked out across the fields.(to walk out?)
    10. The costumer came forward to attend the old man.(to come forward?)
    11. The father turned to his daughter and showed her the letter.(to turn to sb.?)
    12. I donít know where my face stops unless I keep my hat on.(to keep sth. on?)
    Are the following idioms:
    13. He was making his way very carefully.(to make one's way?)
    14. The hook came loose. (to come loose?)
    15. He found himself adrift in the middle of the ocean.(to find oneself somewhere/ +prep.?)
    I found the verbs in 1-12 in the Longman Dictionary of Phrasal Verbs, but according to most definitions of phrasal verbs they donít seem to be phrasal verbs proper.
    Thanks,
    Angela
    There are differences of opinion about what constitutes a phrasal verb. That is why the lists vary. The definition I prefer is: a phrase composed of two (sometimes three) words that act as a verbal unit with an idiomatic meaning.
    That rules out verb + preposition/adverb combinations that have the meaning one would expect from the individual words. By that definition, I would eliminate all of your first 12.

    13 is a an idiom.

    14 & 15 are not idioms.

  3. #3
    BobK's Avatar
    BobK is online now Harmless drudge
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    Re: Troubling phrasal verbs and idioms

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeNewYork View Post
    There are differences of opinion about what constitutes a phrasal verb. That is why the lists vary. The definition I prefer is: a phrase composed of two (sometimes three) words that act as a verbal unit with an idiomatic meaning.
    That rules out verb + preposition/adverb combinations that have the meaning one would expect from the individual words. By that definition, I would eliminate all of your first 12.
    I prefer Mike's definition too, but students should note that in different contexts some of the first 12 can be phrasal:

    Barbara walked away with first prize. [won it easily]
    The police don't know the culprit, but they're looking into it.
    She looked it up in the dictionary
    Fancy running into you here!
    After 20 years of marriage, she just walked out.
    He asked for volunteers, but no one came forward
    Everything he touched turned to gold
    How can I think if you keep on at me like that?


    b
    Last edited by BobK; 30-Oct-2006 at 15:23. Reason: Fix typos

  4. #4
    tangelatm is offline Junior Member
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    Re: Troubling phrasal verbs and idioms

    Thanks, Bob!
    But what about the verbs in 13-15: I found "to make one's way"+ prep; "to find oneself somewhere/+ prep.".What are the corresponding infinitive forms of these verbs (I have to place them between brackets for my students).
    Thanks,
    Angela

  5. #5
    BobK's Avatar
    BobK is online now Harmless drudge
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    Re: Troubling phrasal verbs and idioms

    Quote Originally Posted by tangelatm View Post
    Thanks, Bob!
    But what about the verbs in 13-15: I found "to make one's way"+ prep; "to find oneself somewhere/+ prep.".What are the corresponding infinitive forms of these verbs (I have to place them between brackets for my students).
    Thanks,
    Angela
    ...
    Are the following idioms:
    13. He was making his way very carefully.(to make one's way?)
    14. The hook came loose. (to come loose?)
    15. He found himself adrift in the middle of the ocean.(to find oneself somewhere/ +prep.?)
    ...
    Your first two bracketed infinitives are fine. I'd make [15] more general: "to find oneself + expression of state". The expression of state can take may forms: adjective, adverb, adj. phrase, adv. phrase, various complement clauses ... maybe more.

    Incidentally, on the subject of 'adrift', there's another version of 14 - 'to come adrift'.

    b

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    MikeNewYork's Avatar
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    Re: Troubling phrasal verbs and idioms

    Quote Originally Posted by BobK View Post
    I prefer Mike's definition too, but students should note that in different contexts some of the first 12 can be phrasal:

    Barbara walked away with first prize. [won it easily]
    The police don't know the culprit, but they're looking into it.
    She looked it up in the dictionary
    Fancy running into you here!
    After 20 years of marriage, she just walked out.
    He asked for volunteers, but no one came forward
    Everything he touched turned to gold
    How can I think if you keep on at me like that?


    b
    Thanks. That was an excellent point I failed to make. Because of the "idiom" requirement in the definition, the same word combination can be a phrasal verb (in some contects) and nothing more than a verb + preposition/adverb (in another context). This fact, while true, is tough on students.

    stand up: whe used to describe rising from a chair, this is a regular verb plus adverb.

    stand up: when used to describe being a member of a wedding party or breaking a date, it is a phrasal verb.

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