Page 1 of 5 1 2 3 4 5 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 43

    • Join Date: Sep 2006
    • Posts: 433
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #1

    Any grammar or interpretation mistakes, or any oddities?

    Could someone please have a look at the answers for 'grammar' and 'interpretation' mistakes?
    After spending hours, days, even weeks on them I feel they are not quite right, and donít sparkle. I am not sure if grammar, sentence structure, flow, punctuation, mood and tense are presented in a manner that makes sense. Could someone please do the checking, and make sure that the flow of readability of the answers is correct, and the style is consistent?
    Here's the poem. The questions and their answers follow.


    Stopping By Woods On A Snowy Evening

    Whose woods these are I think I know.
    His house is in the village though;
    He will not see me stopping here
    To watch his woods fill up with snow.

    My little horse must think it queer
    To stop without a farmhouse near
    Between the woods and frozen lake
    The darkest evening of the year.

    He gives his harness bells a shake
    To ask if there is some mistake.
    The only other sound's the sweep
    Of easy wind and downy flake.

    The woods are lovely, dark and deep.

    But I have promises to keep,
    And miles to go before I sleep,
    And miles to go before I sleep.


    Stanza # 04 (All the questions below are related to Stanza No. 4)
    Why canít the poet wait to enjoy the beauty of the woods?
    He canít wait to enjoy the beauty of the woods because he too many responsibilities to fulfill, and has a long distance to travel before he can rest for the night.

    Why does he repeat the third line?
    He repeats the third line to make a strong claim to be the most celebrated instance of repetition in English poetry. The first "And miles to go before I sleep" stays within the boundaries of literalness set forth by the rest of the poem. We may suspect, as we have up to this point, that the poem implies more than it says outright, but we can't insist on it; the poem has gone by so fast, and seemed so straightforward. Then comes the second "And miles to go before I sleep," like a soft yet penetrating gong; it can be neither ignored nor forgotten. The sound it makes is "Ahhh." And we must read the verses again and again and offer trenchant remarks and explain the "Ahhh" in words far inferior to the poem. For the last "miles to go" now seems like life; the last "sleep" now seems like death.

    Which letters have been repeated in the last stanza?
    The letters o and e have been repeated in the last stanza.

    Why have they been repeated?
    They have been repeated to produce a profound impression.

    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • English Teacher
      • Native Language:
      • British English
      • Home Country:
      • UK
      • Current Location:
      • Japan

    • Join Date: Nov 2002
    • Posts: 44,225
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #2

    Re: Any grammar or interpretation mistakes, or any oddities?

    He repeats the third line to make a strong claim to be the most celebrated instance of repetition in English poetry. - This doesn't work for me. I doubt that this is why he did it- it probably is one of the most celebrated repetitions, but not his motive.
    Also, what about the letter I for the third question?


    • Join Date: Sep 2006
    • Posts: 433
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #3

    Re: Any grammar or interpretation mistakes, or any oddities?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tdol View Post
    He repeats the third line to make a strong claim to be the most celebrated instance of repetition in English poetry. - This doesn't work for me. I doubt that this is why he did it- it probably is one of the most celebrated repetitions, but not his motive.
    Also, what about the letter I for the third question?
    Many many many thanks for the help, Tdol. It's so nice of you.

    Then what is his motive, Tdol? Have you gone through the whole answer. I have interpreted both the lines (i.e., 3rd and 4th).

    Do you mean the word "I" or the letter 'i"?

    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • English Teacher
      • Native Language:
      • British English
      • Home Country:
      • UK
      • Current Location:
      • Japan

    • Join Date: Nov 2002
    • Posts: 44,225
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #4

    Re: Any grammar or interpretation mistakes, or any oddities?

    His motive would be poetical- to imprint the line on the reader's memory, wouldn't it?


    • Join Date: Sep 2006
    • Posts: 433
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #5

    Re: Any grammar or interpretation mistakes, or any oddities?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tdol View Post
    His motive would be poetical- to imprint the line on the reader's memory, wouldn't it?
    Dear Tdol,
    It's so nice of you for taking some time out for me, and helping me understand the motive behind the repetition. I can never forget what you have done for me.

    He repeats the third line to imprint it on the reader's memory. Is it enough?

    And could you please clarify the third question as well?

    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • English Teacher
      • Native Language:
      • British English
      • Home Country:
      • UK
      • Current Location:
      • Japan

    • Join Date: Nov 2002
    • Posts: 44,225
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #6

    Re: Any grammar or interpretation mistakes, or any oddities?

    Is it possible to ascribe a motive? I am not sure we can get inside his head as he decided to repeat- it possibly just felt right to him to do it.


    • Join Date: Sep 2006
    • Posts: 433
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #7

    Re: Any grammar or interpretation mistakes, or any oddities?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tdol View Post
    Is it possible to ascribe a motive? I am not sure we can get inside his head as he decided to repeat- it possibly just felt right to him to do it.

    So what do I do with the question? I am quite confused.


    • Join Date: Mar 2007
    • Posts: 101
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #8

    Re: Any grammar or interpretation mistakes, or any oddities?

    Quote Originally Posted by asad hussain View Post
    Stanza # 04
    Why can’t the poet wait to enjoy the beauty of the woods?
    He can’t wait to enjoy the beauty of the woods because he too many responsibilities to fulfill, and has a long distance to travel before he can rest for the night.


    "because he too many responsibilities to fulfill": you forgot to include a verb, here. ("to fulfill" is a verb, but it's not the main verb of the clause)

    Why does he repeat the third line?
    He repeats the third line to make a strong claim to be the most celebrated instance of repetition in English poetry.The first "And miles to go before I sleep" stays within the boundaries of literalness set forth by the rest of the poem. We may suspect, as we have up to this point, that the poem implies more than it says outright, but we can't insist on it; the poem has gone by so fast, and seemed so straightforward. Then comes the second "And miles to go before I sleep," like a soft yet penetrating gong; it can be neither ignored nor forgotten. The sound it makes is "Ahhh." And we must read the verses again and again and offer trenchant remarks and explain the "Ahhh" in words far inferior to the poem. For the last "miles to go" now seems like life; the last "sleep" now seems like death.


    If I read you correctly, you are saying that Frost (the poet) repeats the line to foreground the presence of a non-literal meaning, but not the meaning itself. In other words, the repetition gives the reader/listener of the poem the opportunity to go beyond the literal into the figurative.

    This is a very interesting interesting interpretation. (Like Tdol, I'm not sure about the first sentence, and I'm uncertain I understand the "Ahhh"-part, although the "miles to go" vs. "sleep" explation at the end somewhat explains it.

    I have another idea for you that may support what you said (especailly the "miles" vs. "sleep" argument):

    The poem has a strict rhyme scheme. The first three stanzas go: aaba bbcb ccdc. Three lines rhyme; the line that doesn't rhyme provides the rhyme for the next stanza. There are just enough stanzas to establish a pattern. (You need two stanzas to see that the non-rhyming line rhymes with the rhyme in the following stanza, and another stanza to make sure it's intentional and not a coincidence.) The fourth stanza is the last. Since there is no stanza after the last one, the third line cannot have a none-rhyming line. Now, instead of having just three lines, or just four rhyming lines, the poet chose to repeat the last line. This gives a powerful feeling of "closure"; not only is there no new rhyme, there isn't even a new line. The first "sleep" disrupts the expetation (we would expect a non-rhyming line); the repetition wraps up the poem. (The effect is very much like you described it; that's just the technical side of it.)


    Which letters have been repeated in the last stanza?
    The letters o and e have been repeated in the last stanza.


    This is an odd question, since poetry works on syllables and sounds rather than letters.

    Since the rhyme is [...i:p] in the last stanza, the repeated letters that are most obvious would be: "e" (as "ee", sounding [i:]; it also appears in "lovely" or "promises", but the letter sounds differently there) and "p".

    It's true that the letter "o" is repeated a lot, but it sound differently in "woods", "to", "lovely" and "promises". I'm not sure what the question is about.

    Why have they been repeated?
    They have been repeated to produce a profound impression.
    Since I don't really understand question 3, I can't really answer that one either. "Profound impression" is rather vague, but considering the question itself isn't exactly clear, it might just work.

    ***

    The below might go beyond school assignments, and I've simplified it somewhat. Read only if you're interested. It's not about letters, it's about sounds.

    One thing I did notice about the last stanze is that you use your lips a lot to form the consonants: Linguists name letters according to how they are acticulated, and where they are articulated. Bilabials are consonants that are articulated at the lips: they are "m", "b", and "p". Group them together, and you have a lot of them in the poem.

    "m" is a nasal. This means the air flows through the nose to produce the sound. The "m" sounds softer than either "b" or "p".

    "b" and "p" are plosives; that means that the air is released in an "explosive" manner (other plosives, but not bilabials, are "k", "g", "t" and "d"). "b" is voiced, "p" is not.

    So you have a progression from "soft" to "harsh" sounding consonants, articulated at the lips: m --> b --> p

    Due to the rhyme: [...i:p] all lines end on the harsh "p". The only time the harsh "p" occurs in the middle of a line is at the beginning of the key-word "promises". (This helps make the word stand out.) The weaker relatives occur within the lines: "but", "before", "miles", "promises".

    The consonant effect is enhanced by the "vowel" effect: within the poem "dark" vowals prevail (a, o, ai, u...) while all lines end on a bright, long "i:". (Notice how the last stanza doesn't have an "e" sound at all, like "bed", or an "ei" sound like "late"?) Again, the word "promises" is the exception: it has an "I"-sound at the end, and possibly another one after the "m", depending on how much you stress the word when reading. (I say "proməsIz" when I read the poem.)

    The effect this has is to make the line-endings more forceful than the lines themselves, and to make the word "promises" stand out.


    • Join Date: Sep 2006
    • Posts: 433
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #9

    Re: Any grammar or interpretation mistakes, or any oddities?

    Dear Dawn storm,
    Itís so nice of you for talking some of your very precious time out for me, and giving such a great and commendable deal of help. I donít have enough words to say thanks, nor do I know the way I am supposed to thank you. I can NOT forget this kind deed of yours till the end of my life. So many thanks!
    Iíve tried to edit the answers using your words. If you donít mind, could you please see if thereís still something lacking, or if there are still some mistakes?

    Why canít the poet wait to enjoy the beauty of the woods?
    He canít wait to enjoy the beauty of the woods, because he has too many responsibilities to fulfill, and has a long distance to travel before he can rest for the night.

    Why does he repeat the third line?
    He repeats the third line in order to imprint it on the readerís memory, as well as to foreground the presence of a non-literal meaning, but not the meaning itself. In other words, the repetition gives the reader of the poem the opportunity to go beyond the literal into the figurative. Furthermore, the poem has a strict rhyme scheme. The first three stanzas go: aaba bbcb ccdc. Three lines rhyme; the line that doesn't rhyme provides the rhyme for the next stanza. There are just enough stanzas to establish a pattern. The fourth stanza is the last. Since there is no stanza after the last one, the third line cannot have a none-rhyming line. Now, instead of having just three lines, or just four rhyming lines, the poet chose to repeat the last line. This gives a powerful feeling of "closure"; not only is there no new rhyme, there isn't even a new line. The first "sleep" disrupts the expectation (we would expect a non-rhyming line); the repetition wraps up the poem.

    Which letters have been repeated in the last stanza?
    Since the rhyme is [...i:p] in the last stanza, the repeated letters that are most obvious would be: "e" (as "ee", sounding [i:]; it also appears in "lovely" or "promises", but the letter sounds differently there) and "p". It's true that the letter "o" is also repeated a lot, but it sounds differently in "woods", "to", "lovely" and "promises".

    Why have they been repeated?
    They might have been repeated to produce a profound impression.
    Last edited by asad hussain; 24-Apr-2007 at 21:46.


    • Join Date: Mar 2007
    • Posts: 101
    • Post Thanks / Like
    #10

    Re: Any grammar or interpretation mistakes, or any oddities?

    Hi,

    I see you've copied some of the things I've said. While you're welcome to do so, please make sure you understand what I said (you probably do, but I thought to point it out). Also, there are some things I wrote in this thread that I wouldn't advise you to put into the assignment.

    "reader's/listener's": I'd choose one and stick with it. Reader is probably more natural.

    "This is an odd question, since poetry works on syllables and sounds rather than letters. Since the rhyme is [...i:p] in the last stanza, the repeated letters that are most obvious would be: "e" (as "ee", sounding [i:]; it also appears in "lovely" or "promises", but the letter sounds differently there) and "p". It's true that the letter "o" is also repeated a lot, but it sounds differently in "woods", "to", "lovely" and "promises". "

    I'm not sure if this is an appropriate answer to the question. How does your teacher react if you criticise the question? Finally, "It's ture that the letter 'o'..." is a direct reply to your original answer and makes little sense without it. I wouldn't keep it like that. I wish I could be of more help, but as I said, I'm not sure about the question.

    About the final line: What if the teacher asks you what the "profound effect" looks like? What would you answer?

    "
    because he has too many responsibilities to fulfill": Correct.



Page 1 of 5 1 2 3 4 5 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Is there a grammar of spoken English?
    By M56 in forum General Language Discussions
    Replies: 25
    Last Post: 09-Feb-2009, 01:58
  2. RE: Grammar mistakes
    By jjamshed in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 10-Oct-2006, 17:59
  3. please check grammar mistakes.
    By bosun in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 10-Oct-2006, 07:01
  4. Plese check grammar mistakes( urgent!!!)
    By bosun in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 19-Aug-2006, 18:19
  5. Grammar Mistakes
    By easy learner in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 07-Aug-2005, 13:48

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •