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Thread: It was....

  1. #1
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    Default It was....

    As Micheal said in Pratical English Usage,
    Subject form+that
    Object form+who

    Ex: It was me that needs your help
    It was I who needs your help
    So, if I write :
    It was John Lennon ___ wrote the song
    a) who
    b) that
    Could you help?

  2. #2
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    Default Re: It was....

    First, I have two questions.

    1) What does Swan mean by 'form', a pronoun?
    2) Aren't the examples the opposite of what Swan is saying?

    Subject form (e.g., I) + that
    Object form (e.g., me) + who

    Ex: It was me that needs your help. <object pronoun>
    Ex: It was I who needs your help. <subject pronoun>

    Help.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: It was....

    He said:" When a relative clause comes after an expression like It is/was smell. there are two possibilities:...."
    It was I who needs your help is subject form
    It was me that needs..... is object form

  4. #4
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    Default Re: It was....

    OK. So, the usage note here is incorrect, right?

    Usage
    Subject form+that
    Object form+who

    It should be switched. Like this, right?

    Usage
    Subject form + who
    Object form + that

    Is that right?

    In answer to your question, the name John Lennon is a noun, not a pronoun, or a 'form'. Either that or who would work.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: It was....

    Right
    But you haven't answer mine yet
    So, if I write :

    It was John Lennon ___ wrote the song

    a) who

    b) that

    Could you help?

  6. #6
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    Default Re: It was....

    Quote Originally Posted by Casiopea View Post
    ...
    In answer to your question, the name John Lennon is a noun, not a pronoun, or a 'form'. Either that or who would work.
    Quote Originally Posted by Belly T View Post
    Right
    But you haven't answer mine yet
    So, if I write :

    It was John Lennon ___ wrote the song

    a) who

    b) that

    Could you help?
    What sense of 'haven't' is that?

    b

  7. #7
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    Default Re: It was....

    Sorry, Belly T, I'm tired today. Here's the answer you are looking for:

    Specific: It was John Lennon who wrote the book.
    General: It was John Lennon that wrote the book.

    Here's the difference the way I see it. (I do not know what Swan thinks about the variation.) If John Lennon is the topic of the conversation, then speakers might use who as a specific reference marker. If John Lennon isn't the topic of the conversation, say, the conversation is about the book or even about some other famous person, then speakers might use that as a general reference marker to show that John Lennon isn't the topic of the conversation.

    Note that, not every speaker feels its grammatical to use relative that with a person's name.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: It was....

    Everey speaker but not my teacher

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