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  1. Grablevskij's Avatar
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    #1

    Whichever one of you

    There is a book Advanced Grammar in Use by Martin Hewings.
    And it is written in it:

    Relative clauses begins with whatever, whoever or whichever are used to talk about things or people that are indefinite or unknown.

    And there is one of the examples that astonishes me:

    Whichever one of you broke the window will have to pay for it.

    Why do they need one of you? Can we not use whichever of you?

    Michael

  2. Grablevskij's Avatar
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    #2

    Re: Whichever one of you

    And now I notice another exercise there:

    A plumber is... job it is to...

    I would say: a plumber is a person whose job is to repair sanitation.

    Michael

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    #3

    Re: Whichever one of you

    Quote Originally Posted by Grablevskij View Post
    There is a book Advanced Grammar in Use by Martin Hewings.
    And it is written in it:

    Relative clauses begins with whatever, whoever or whichever are used to talk about things or people that are indefinite or unknown.

    And there is one of the examples that astonishes me:

    Whichever one of you broke the window will have to pay for it.

    Why do they need one of you? Can we not use whichever of you?

    Michael
    Yes you can.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grablevskij View Post
    And now I notice another exercise there:

    A plumber is... job it is to...

    I would say: a plumber is a person whose job is to repair sanitation.

    Michael
    You can use either. I would expect the following contexts:

    A plumber is a person whose job it is to ...

    A plumber is the person whose job is to repair sanitation - not a carpenter.


    That is, the second defines a plumber (among other tradespeople) and the second simply explains what a plumber does. But this distinction is arguable.

    b
    Last edited by BobK; 25-Aug-2007 at 13:44. Reason: Fix typo

  4. Grablevskij's Avatar
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    #4

    Re: Whichever one of you

    Sorry about the sanitary, let it be pipes.

    Well.

    1) Whichever of you broke the window will have to pay for it.
    2) Whichever one of you broke the window will have to pay for it.

    But I still can not understand the construction.

    In the first case, we have whichever as a subject of a relative clause and break as a verb.

    In the second case, I even can not tell anything. "Of you" relates to one.
    What is whichever relates to? And where is the subject of the relative clause?

    Michael


    Where is the subject

  5. Casiopea's Avatar

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    #5

    Re: Whichever one of you

    Whichever is short for whichever one of X (a thing, not a person), and the word one or the phrase one of the, even the entire phrase one of the X is often omitted:

    Adjective
    Take whichever one of the books you please.
    Take whichever of the books you please.
    Take whichever books you please.

    Pronoun
    Take whichever you please.



    Now to your examples:

    Adjective
    a. Whichever one of you broke the window ...
    b. Whichever of you broke the window ...
    c. Whichever you broke the window. <!pronoun>
    d. Whichever broke the window ...
    e. Whoever broke the window ...

    Note on c., you is a pronoun; it can't be modified by an adjective. The preposition of is needed to accommodate the syntax: whichever of you.

    Note on d., as a pronoun whichever refers to things, and whoever refers to people.

    Does that help?

  6. Grablevskij's Avatar
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    #6

    Re: Whichever one of you

    Thank you very much for your help. Maybe I can catch the idea now. Or I may not.

    Yes, we recognize noun pronouns (This is what he said) and adjective pronouns (These books are interesting). Therefore whichever is an adjective pronoun here, and one is a noun pronoun (similar example: this one).

    "Whichever one" is rather cumbersome, do you not think like that?
    Maybe it is used only in formal speach, am I right?

    Michael

  7. Grablevskij's Avatar
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    #7

    Re: Whichever one of you

    Sorry, but what about the plumber.

    A plumber is a person whose job it is to ...

    Which is the subject: job or it?

    Michael

  8. Grablevskij's Avatar
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    #8

    Re: Whichever one of you

    We can use it instead of job. Why should I put job and it in a row?

    Michael

  9. Casiopea's Avatar

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    #9

    Re: Whichever one of you

    Quote Originally Posted by Grablevskij View Post
    A plumber is a person whose job it is to ...

    Which is the subject: job or it?
    The one that's closest to the verb is:
    Ex: A plumber is a person whose job (that) it is to repair the pipes. <subject + verb>
    Omit it and whose job becomes the subject:
    Ex: A plumber is a person whose job is to repair the pipes. <subject + verb>
    --------------
    I don't find the phrase whichever one awkward here:
    Ex: Take whichever one you want.
    But it is awkward here:

    Ex: Whichever one broke the window will have to pay.
    Meaning, a thing broke the window and it has to pay.
    Ex: Whichever one of you broke the window will have to pay.
    Meaning, a person broke the window and s/he has to pay.
    Does that help?

  10. Grablevskij's Avatar
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    #10

    Re: Whichever one of you

    Let me try one more time.
    About whichever:

    Whichever one of you
    Only one of them is meant.

    Whichever of you
    One, two, three of them or maybe the whole group is meant.

    About the plumber:

    A plumber is a person whose job it is to repair pipes.
    It is to repair pipes that is a plumber's job.

    A plumber is a person whose job is to repair pipes.
    To repair pipes is a plumber's job.

    Is is just an emphatic construction with a subject "it"?

    Michael

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