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Thread: turn the tide

  1. #1
    vil is offline VIP Member
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    Default turn the tide

    Dear teachers and native speakers!

    By reading I have met very oft the phrase "turn the tide" as in "The Battle of Saratoga turned the tide of the American Revolution. The meaning of this idiom have to be "to reverse the course of events, esp. from one extreme to another. This is intelligibly, but to my mind, it is wrong, physical and cosmic ill-grounded. WE must to consider this matter in all its aspects. From one point of view, this reverse must be one and for all. But for the second hand, tide = the periodic rise and fall of the waters of the ocean and its inlets, produced by the attraction of the moon and sun, and occurring about every 12 hours. Consequently this reverse will be go on recurring at regular intervals. Then who ought to have been done winner? The both generals Lee and Grand was watched o's opportunity-imply theirs favorable tide.
    I think the phrase "turn the tide" is incredible-a glaring injustice.

    It is different at the following phrases:

    "row against the tide" and "Go against the stream". They are clearly and true.

    Would you try to persuade me?

    I beg your pardon for my unsuccessfully writing. Nevertheles I am only a few years self-educated lover of English language.

  2. #2
    Anglika is offline No Longer With Us
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    Default Re: turn the tide

    Quote Originally Posted by vil View Post
    Dear teachers and native speakers!

    By reading I have met very oft the phrase "turn the tide" as in "The Battle of Saratoga turned the tide of the American Revolution. The meaning of this idiom have to be "to reverse the course of events, esp. from one extreme to another. This is intelligibly, but to my mind, it is wrong, physical and cosmic ill-grounded. WE must to consider this matter in all its aspects. From one point of view, this reverse must be one and for all. But for the second hand, tide = the periodic rise and fall of the waters of the ocean and its inlets, produced by the attraction of the moon and sun, and occurring about every 12 hours. Consequently this reverse will be go on recurring at regular intervals. Then who ought to have been done winner? The both generals Lee and Grand was watched o's opportunity-imply theirs favorable tide.
    I think the phrase "turn the tide" is incredible-a glaring injustice.

    It is different at the following phrases:

    "row against the tide" and "Go against the stream". They are clearly and true.

    Would you try to persuade me?

    I beg your pardon for my unsuccessfully writing. Nevertheles I am only a few years self-educated lover of English language.
    You may well feel it is unjustified - but sadly you cannot change the tide of language and the way it works. This is a very old idiom and perfectly well understood.

    In the case of the Battle of Saratoga, it is like the moon's gravitational pull reaching the point at which the tide ceases to fall, stops and begins to return. It is a metaphor, and is not concerned with the physical nature of tides, but with the concept that the affairs of man have a flow and ebb of their own, which can reach their apogee with a particular event..

  3. #3
    vil is offline VIP Member
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    Default Re: turn the tide

    Thank you, Anglika, for your edifying and subtle upbraiding explanation. Your brief speech for defense of above mentioned idiom was very convincing.

    I wonder whether you could tell me why the title of the Balsak's novel "Splendeurs et miseres des courtisanes" have an unpretending interpretation "A Harlot High and Low"? Maybe the translator didn't like metaphors and idioms.

  4. #4
    Anglika is offline No Longer With Us
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    Default Re: turn the tide

    You would have to ask Mr Heppenstall that question. It is most likely that he felt an exact translation of the French title would look pretentious and give an inaccurate idea of the book. Translating titles is never an exact science.

  5. #5
    vil is offline VIP Member
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    Default Re: turn the tide

    I see, you could recommend me to search high and law to ask Mr.Lyton Strachey that question, if he was alive yet.
    I think, I saw what you mean. I have no objections.

    V.

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