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  1. #1
    riverkid is offline Banned
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    Default What does frequency in language mean?

    This thread is a continuation of the thread, "Proper use of "you and .....", which can be found at,

    http://www.usingenglish.com/forum/as...r-use-you.html

    {In order that all students and the original questioner be aware of this, I respectfully request that a moderator add a link at that now locked thread pointing to this new thread.}

    ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

    Naamplao wrote:
    #1 Results 1 - 10 of about 10,300 English pages for "to Bob and myself".
    #2 Results 1 - 10 of about 172,000 English pages for "to Bob and I".

    A 94.3% support for #2 (our position)

    #3 Results 1 - 10 of about 24,100 English pages for "to Bill and myself".
    #4 Results 1 - 10 of about 220,000 English pages for "to Bill and I".

    A 90.1% support for #4 (our position)

    ...

    Gentlemen or Ladies, as the case may be.

    How do you figure that statistics that show one collocation having a greater frequency means that another or others are not found in language? By this skewed reasoning, 'whom' is invalid; the pronouns that tally last in the list are not of English, and the subjunctive, well, see for yourself.

    Results 1 - 10 of about 7,270,000 English pages for "If I was"

    Results 1 - 10 of about 1,860,000 English pages for "If I were".


    2006 wrote:

    1...No one said that one couldn't find examples of bad English on the internet. (assuming those are all examples of "override pronouns") What some of us said is that we prefer not to teach bad English.
    You just keep repeating the same old thing, 2006, but you still haven't shown us anything in the way of proof to support your position. That's nothing at all. And the same has come from everyone else, nothing.

    With all due respect, why would anyone accept what you have to say on this issue? This is not a rhetorical question. Please explain to us why your opinion should be the deciding factor on language issues. Naamplao, [and some others] you're in the same boat so could you please inform us as to why anyone, ESL or ENL, should simply accept your opinions?

    By contrast, I have provided sourcing from the most recognized language sources on the planet. I'll let Merriam-Webster have the last word, that is, unless you're ready to offer your proof, in which case, we may have reason for further discussion.


    M-W:

    myself

    usage Myself is often used where I or me might be expected: as subject <to wonder what myself will say — Emily Dickinson> <others and myself continued to press for the legislation>, after as, than, or like <an aversion to paying such people as myself to tutor> <was enough to make a better man than myself quail> <old-timers like myself>, and as object <now here you see myself with the diver> <for my wife and myself it was a happy time>.

    Such uses almost always occur when the speaker or writer is referring to himself or herself as an object of discourse rather than as a participant in discourse. The other reflexive personal pronouns are similarly but less frequently used in the same circumstances. Critics have frowned on these uses since about the turn of the century, probably unaware that they serve a definite purpose. Users themselves are as unaware as the critics—they simply follow their instincts. These uses are standard.
    Last edited by riverkid; 15-Dec-2007 at 17:58.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: What does frequency in language mean?

    This is interesting. I'd always thought that "myself" was a vulgar affectation. Thanks for showing me that there are legitimate uses.
    Let's continue to share information and enjoy the process. There's no need to get personal. At times I'm disturbed by the tone.
    regards
    edward

  3. #3
    riverkid is offline Banned
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    Default Re: What does frequency in language mean?

    Moderators,

    Please remove the advertisements from my postings. It's just not kosher to attach ads to peoples' postings.

  4. #4
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    Default Re: What does frequency in language mean?

    Could you please explain what you mean? I think you may be referring to the fact that I posted a comment on your posting.

    edward

    Quote Originally Posted by riverkid View Post
    Moderators,

    Please remove the advertisements from my postings. It's just not kosher to attach ads to peoples' postings.

  5. #5
    riverkid is offline Banned
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    Default Re: What does frequency in language mean?

    Quote Originally Posted by baqarah131 View Post
    Could you please explain what you mean? I think you may be referring to the fact that I posted a comment on your posting.

    edward
    I'm glad you asked, Edward. i wouldn't want you to have thought I meant your posting. I certainly wasn't referring to your posting. I recognized your posting for what it was, a blessed moment of sanity.

    Sometimes advertisements are added to people's postings and I just don't think it's right or fair to do so.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: What does frequency in language mean?

    Thank you. I'm not tech-savvy and I was alarmed that I might have unintentionally offended or broken a rule.

    It's not surprising that things go wrong occasionally. People do take advantage of opportunities, at the expense of the original intent.

    The wonder is that ideas like Usingenglish.com and Wikipedia work at all, considering how many people are willing to use good ideas for their own purposes.

    Valuing your input
    edward

    Quote Originally Posted by riverkid View Post
    I'm glad you asked, Edward. i wouldn't want you to have thought I meant your posting. I certainly wasn't referring to your posting. I recognized your posting for what it was, a blessed moment of sanity.

    Sometimes advertisements are added to people's postings and I just don't think it's right or fair to do so.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: What does frequency in language mean?

    A few basic rules.

    1. The thread was locked by a moderator for a reason. The discussion is over, and any attempts to revive it will be blocked.

    2. The adverts are there to defray the cost of running of the forums. If you, riverkid, want to pay the hosting costs, we will of course gladly remove the adverts.

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