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  1. #11
    Clark is offline Key Member
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    Default Re: vocabulary or vocabularies

    I feel I must reply to this post:

    Quote Originally Posted by Snowcake View Post
    Why make things unnecessarily hard for learners - especially for beginners?

    Exactly! Why welcome stylistically coloured half-slang words when a huge resource of standard English is still virgin land?


    That's not a helpful way to encourage learners, and reassure them, particularly when they don't feel confident enough with an appropriate usage of the foreign language.

    You are reading my mind!


    Hmmm, I don't mean to start an argument.

    But: "It's not what you say, but the way you say it."


    We have already started it, and I see no harm in this, as long as we talk sense and respect one another's opinion.

    Has the last phrase something to do with my post or somebody else's post?

    Last edited by Clark; 30-May-2008 at 20:57.

  2. #12
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    Default Re: vocabulary or vocabularies

    Uh oh. Can I add my opinion?

    As an American, I say "wanna" most of the time. As someone who makes her living writing, I would never use "wanna" in a business communication. I use it in chat and I use it in casual e-mails to my friends.

    It seems to me that people come to ESL forums to learn the type of English they need for examinations or work. Therefore, it seems to me that when writing,efforts should be made to comply with the rules of written English, unless we're specifically discussing pronunciation.

    So I support trying to keep writing like "thanx 2 u for ur help" and "if u cud help me, i'd be happy" -- no matter how friendly the tone -- out of posts that talk about grammar. (And support talking about how we often leave letters out in actual pronunciation.)

    Just my two cents.

  3. #13
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    Default Re: vocabulary or vocabularies

    Agreed, 100%.

  4. #14
    Snowcake's Avatar
    Snowcake is offline Senior Member
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    Default Re: vocabulary or vocabularies

    Why make things unnecessarily hard for learners - especially for beginners?

    Exactly! Why welcome stylistically coloured half-slang words when a huge resource of standard English is still virgin land?

    Clark, I must confess that this issue is one of my sore spots. I had several English teachers, and one of them (fortunately, it was only one!) tended to look at you as if you had a big pimple in your face when you were trying to speak English. Not that the students weren't able to speak properly, but they made mistakes, otherwise they wouldn't have attended the course. It was a kind of disrespect to the students' efforts. But don't get me wrong. This story was on my mind, and I wanted to tell it just to make clear why I decided to take part in this discussion. It's not that I consider you to be disrespectful - not at all.

    So back to the topic at hand: You're right. A forum like this should promote a proper and appropriate usage of the English language - and I'm quite sure there is no better place to learn English, and its differentely used registers than in this forum where a lot of assisting and very kind people spend their spare time on helping others.

    So there is no problem with advising someone of the different registers and pointing out their mistakes.
    That's why this forum exists.

    It was just that I wasn't happy with this part of your previous post 'funny, to put in mildly'. It may well be the case that I took the wrong way, and mistook your words.




    That's not a helpful way to encourage learners, and reassure them, particularly when they don't feel confident enough with an appropriate usage of the foreign language.

    You are reading my mind!


    Hmmm, I don't mean to start an argument.

    But: "It's not what you say, but the way you say it."

    We have already started it, and I see no harm in this, as long as we talk sense and respect one another's opinion.

    Has the last phrase something to do with my post or somebody else's post?

    Yes, it has.
    No problem with pointing out mistakes, but I for one would appreciate it if we would all bear in mind that the users here have different levels of English. (BTW, this phrase hasn't anything to do with the use of slang expressions. It wasn't meant to minimise the inappropriate / incorrect use of registers, in the sense of: it's OK to write 'wanna ur help' as long as you take a friendly tone )

    I agree with Barb: I'm quite puzzled when I read sentences like "Could u help me pls" and I think it is important to correct such 'misuses'. Otherwise, mistakes can creep in rapidly and take hold, making it difficult to get rid of them in the long run. So I don't welcome stylistically coloured half-slang words, at least to promote is as standard English. As far as I know, it is part of (some) exams to be able to distinguish between various formal and informal language registers. In this vein, I welcome helping students get engaged and aware of different registers.

    Last edited by Snowcake; 31-May-2008 at 21:53.

  5. #15
    Soup's Avatar
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    Default Re: vocabulary or vocabularies

    Quote Originally Posted by Clark View Post
    There are some words and forms that sound odd when they are used by a non-native speaker. I have nothing against 'wonna, gonna' when they come from the mouth of a native English speaker. But when a learner of English uses them it sounds funny, to put in mildly.
    It only sounds funny (i.e., strange) if the pronunciation is off:

    wanna => w[o]nna
    wanna => <a> as in water.

  6. #16
    Clark is offline Key Member
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    Default Re: vocabulary or vocabularies

    Quote Originally Posted by Soup View Post
    It only sounds funny (i.e., strange) if the pronunciation is off:

    wanna => w[o]nna
    wanna => <a> as in water.
    Soup, I could say that I misspelled the word on purpose, in order to ridicule it, but I won't.

    You might say I'm not in a position to judge, being a non-native English speaker myself. I thought if a native speaker said that it would sound like 'Quod licet iovi, non licet bovi'. That's why I decided it was my line.

    When I hear non-Russian speakers use slang or low-colloquials, it irritates my ear. I always feel like telling them, 'Why don't you learn a few grammar rules first?'
    Last edited by Clark; 31-May-2008 at 06:44.

  7. #17
    tedtmc is offline Key Member
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    Default Re: vocabulary or vocabularies

    non-teacher

    IMHO, Slangs and colloquial words like wanna, gotta, kinda..(which are handy for SMS messages, online chats, etc.) should not be encouraged in a forum which is meant to promote proper and correct use of English.

  8. #18
    Soup's Avatar
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    Default Re: vocabulary or vocabularies

    Quote Originally Posted by tedtmc View Post
    proper and correct use of English.
    Define that, first.

  9. #19
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    Default Re: vocabulary or vocabularies

    thank you very much for your replies. what i really wanted top say that i didn't like the way some members replied against the use of "wanna". BTW i lived in the states and i was married to an American so it is not a matter of being native speaker or not as we use English to communicate and it sounded more friendly to me. Again I would like to thank you all for your illustrations and i hope that we can realize the difference between talking and discussing some issues and formal ways of writing.

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