Results 1 to 9 of 9
  1. #1
    Olympian is offline Member
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Interested in Language
      • Native Language:
      • Hindi
      • Home Country:
      • India
      • Current Location:
      • India
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    458
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default "Innocent till proven guilty"

    Hello,

    I have always heard "innocent till proven guilty."
    But today I heard this on TV: "innocent till proved guilty"

    Is it correct to use "proved"?

    Thank you.

  2. #2
    susiedqq is offline Key Member
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Academic
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • United States
      • Current Location:
      • United States
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,944
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Re: "Innocent till proven guilty"

    The legal quote uses "proven."

    Sportscasters would probably use "proved"

  3. #3
    Olympian is offline Member
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Interested in Language
      • Native Language:
      • Hindi
      • Home Country:
      • India
      • Current Location:
      • India
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    458
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Re: "Innocent till proven guilty"

    Thank you Susiedqq. I take it that it is correct to use both.

  4. #4
    susiedqq is offline Key Member
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Academic
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • United States
      • Current Location:
      • United States
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    2,944
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Re: "Innocent till proven guilty"

    Sorry - I was joking.

    use "proven"

  5. #5
    Olympian is offline Member
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Interested in Language
      • Native Language:
      • Hindi
      • Home Country:
      • India
      • Current Location:
      • India
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    458
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Re: "Innocent till proven guilty"

    Sorry, your joke was lost on me (despite the wink), susiedqq.

    OK. Thanks. I naturally think of 'proven' because that is what I have always read/heard. But this man's comment got me thinking if "proved" is indeed wrong.

  6. #6
    BobK's Avatar
    BobK is offline Harmless drudge
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • English Teacher
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • UK
      • Current Location:
      • UK
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    15,649
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Re: "Innocent till proven guilty"

    Quote Originally Posted by Olympian View Post
    Sorry, your joke was lost on me (despite the wink), susiedqq.

    OK. Thanks. I naturally think of 'proven' because that is what I have always read/heard. But this man's comment got me thinking if "proved" is indeed wrong.
    Br E is more tolerant of 'proveD'.

    COCA ([Davies/BYU] The Corpus of Contemporary American English (COCA) ) has 293 hits for 'proven guilty' and 34 for 'proved guilty'.

    The hits in BNC (a much smaller sample - [Davies/BYU] BYU-BNC: British National Corpus ) are nearly even.

    b

  7. #7
    Olympian is offline Member
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Interested in Language
      • Native Language:
      • Hindi
      • Home Country:
      • India
      • Current Location:
      • India
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    458
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Re: "Innocent till proven guilty"

    Quote Originally Posted by BobK View Post
    Br E is more tolerant of 'proveD'.

    COCA ([Davies/BYU] The Corpus of Contemporary American English (COCA) ) has 293 hits for 'proven guilty' and 34 for 'proved guilty'.

    The hits in BNC (a much smaller sample - [Davies/BYU] BYU-BNC: British National Corpus ) are nearly even.

    b

    BobK, Thank you for this information, and for sharing this resource.

    I tried looking up "proven guilty" on COCA but I got a different result (206/14). I think it is because I don't know how to look up properly. I simply entered the words "proven guilty" and clicked the "search" button. Do I need to do anything else? I chose the default "List" radio button, and I did not choose anything else.
    Last edited by Olympian; 28-Aug-2008 at 23:09. Reason: Cleaned up the dictionary names that got inadvertently included in the posting after the spellcheker came up.

  8. #8
    BobK's Avatar
    BobK is offline Harmless drudge
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • English Teacher
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • UK
      • Current Location:
      • UK
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    15,649
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Re: "Innocent till proven guilty"

    When you specify two words verbatim, the search engine looks for just that pair with no intervening word/s - excluding expressions like 'proven him guilty' or 'proven the Englishman guilty'.

    On the initial search screen, click on Compare Words. Type proven" and "proved" into the two boxes, and "guilty" into the Context box.

    b
    PS don't make the mistake of regarding me as any kind of "COCA superuser"; I'm just a few weeks ahead of you in the process of trial and error".

  9. #9
    Olympian is offline Member
    • Member Info
      • Member Type:
      • Interested in Language
      • Native Language:
      • Hindi
      • Home Country:
      • India
      • Current Location:
      • India
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    458
    Post Thanks / Like

    Default Re: "Innocent till proven guilty"

    Quote Originally Posted by BobK View Post
    When you specify two words verbatim, the search engine looks for just that pair with no intervening word/s - excluding expressions like 'proven him guilty' or 'proven the Englishman guilty'.

    On the initial search screen, click on Compare Words. Type proven" and "proved" into the two boxes, and "guilty" into the Context box.

    b
    PS don't make the mistake of regarding me as any kind of "COCA superuser"; I'm just a few weeks ahead of you in the process of trial and error".

    BobK, thank you very much for teaching me how to do the search.

    You are very modest. OK, even if you are not a superuser, you are still an expert in my view.

Similar Threads

  1. usage of Until and Till
    By Unregistered in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 23-May-2008, 03:45
  2. Till death do us part
    By savozaul in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 21-Feb-2008, 14:41
  3. To proven or not to proven
    By RuthOU in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 26-Apr-2007, 11:15
  4. Never put off the work till...
    By Joe in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 09-Mar-2004, 16:51

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •