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  1. #1
    Egyption Arrow is offline Member
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    Arrow In and of themselves

    In the name of the Merciful Allah,
    Hi, When I say: Most things that are enjoyed in and of themselves vary from person to person, I think of " in themselves" as they're considered joyful intrinsically alone, and " of themselves" as they're joyful through other things considered along with them, so " of" here refers to " resulting from" or "caused by". Am I right?

  2. #2
    Egyption Arrow is offline Member
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    Default Re: In and of themselves

    What do you think?

  3. #3
    Egyption Arrow is offline Member
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    Default Re: In and of themselves

    Am I right?

  4. #4
    Egyption Arrow is offline Member
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    Default Re: In and of themselves

    Am I right? Am I right? Am I right? Am I right? Am I right?

  5. #5
    Egyption Arrow is offline Member
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    Default Re: In and of themselves

    What do you think?Am I right?

  6. #6
    Egyption Arrow is offline Member
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    Default Re: In and of themselves

    It seems I'm right, right?

  7. #7
    Barb_D's Avatar
    Barb_D is online now Moderator
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    Default Re: In and of themselves

    Oh my goodness! You need to give people a chance to response.

    The phrase "in and of itself/themselves" is a standard, idiomatic phrase and like most idioms, should not be parsed too finely.

    It simply means that you consider it as a whole, without context, and without considering the role it plays.

    It's usually used to contrast how it works within a specific context.

    The fact that she cried during the funeral isn't surprising in and of itself, but the fact that it's the first time she's shown any emotion at all since the accident is a good thing.

  8. #8
    Egyption Arrow is offline Member
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    Default Re: In and of themselves

    So, " of themselves" here refers to the same thing as " in themselves", which is the absence of the context. I don't think so.
    What about the difference between the two of them?
    I think the difference is in the existence of the context, for one of them.
    Am I right?
    Last edited by Egyption Arrow; 15-Apr-2009 at 18:37.

  9. #9
    Barb_D's Avatar
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    Default Re: In and of themselves

    The set, standard phrase is "in and of itself" or "in and of themselves."

    That's what it is. Don't try to parse it.

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