arrange v. set up

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hhtt21

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I confuse between verbs arrange and set up. I feel there are some situations that these two meanings fit. There are several meanings of both arrange and set up.

1. "Set up the books on the shelves in chronical order"
2. "Arrange the books on the shleves in chronical order."

Are these two sentences just the same in meaning, i.e exactly the same in meaning?

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Charlie Bernstein

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I'm confused about the verbs arrange and set up. I feel there are some situations that these two terms fit. There are several meanings of both arrange and set up.

1. "Set up the books on the shelves in chronological order"
2. "Arrange the books on the shelves in chronological order."

Do these two sentences have the same in meaning, i.e exactly the same in meaning?

Thank you.

They mean the same thing. Sentence 2 is slightly more natural, but both are good.
 

hhtt21

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What do you think about 3. "Put the books on the shelves in chronological order."

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jutfrank

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What's a chronological order of books? Do you mean alphabetical order?


  • arrange = put elements into a particular order
  • set up = arrange elements, in order to prepare to do something with those elements

You set up chess pieces on a chessboard in preparation for a game.
 

hhtt21

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What's a chronological order of books? Do you mean alphabetical order?


  • arrange = put elements into a particular order
  • set up = arrange elements, in order to prepare to do something with those elements

You set up chess pieces on a chessboard in preparation for a game.

As you can see, I am a learner and my English is very weak, so I don't exactly know what exactly "chronological" order means for this context but it is probably printing time of books, I would imagine. I tried to make a similarity looking this link:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chronology

But it is off-topic for this tread because in my last post, I was questioning verb to put and its relation to the verbs to arrange and to set up along with the context. So it is not important to deal the example with alphebetical order or with chronological order. So lets think of these three:

1) Put the books on the shelves in chronological order.
2) Set up the books on the shelves in chronological order.
3) Arrange the books on the shelves in chronological order.

What is the difference among these sentences, are they identical in meaning ie do they have the same meaning? Or which of them are natural or idiomatic?

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jutfrank

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1) Put the books on the shelves in chronological order.
2) Set up the books on the shelves in chronological order.
3) Arrange the books on the shelves in chronological order.

What is the difference among these sentences, are they identical in meaning ie do they have the same meaning? Or which of them are natural or idiomatic?

1) is okay
3) is much better
2) is not right

For the differences in meaning, see my previous post #4.
 

Tdol

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As you can see, I am a learner and my English is very weak, so I don't exactly know what exactly "chronological" order means for this context but it is probably printing time of books, I would imagine.


I had a teacher at my university who grouped his books chronologically- grouping them by period - and then placed them in alphabetical order within the different periods. It seems logical to me- he had his medieval books together, in A-Z order, and his modern books separately the same way.
 
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emsr2d2

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I had a teacher at my university who grouped his books chronologically- grouping them by period - and then placed them in alphabetical order within the different periods. It seems logical to me- he had his medieval books together, in A-Z order, and his modern books separately the same way.

Ah, my kind of OCD. ;-)
 

hhtt21

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What's a chronological order of books? Do you mean alphabetical order?


  • arrange = put elements into a particular order
  • set up = arrange elements, in order to prepare to do something with those elements

You set up chess pieces on a chessboard in preparation for a game.

2) is not right

For the differences in meaning, see my previous post #4.

As an American, Charlie Bernstein finds "set up" good but you are not so is this an American vice British detail?

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hhtt21

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Rover_KE

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That's very sad. I recommend you retire for an early night like I'm about to do with my book at bedtime:

Care of the Elderly by Jerry Attrick-Holmes.
 

hhtt21

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No. I would not use 'set up' in that sense and neither, apparently, would Jutfrank. Others would..
Do you mean it is a preference and neither you and nor Jutfrank would use set up instead of arrange in this way, but other people might prefer?

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GoesStation

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Then this dictionary is wrong

http://www.wordwebonline.com/search.pl?w=arrange

Set up:put into a proper or systematic order
"set up the books on the shelves in chronological order";

http://www.wordwebonline.com/search.pl?w=arrange

Do you mean it is a preference and neither you and nor Jutfrank would use set up instead of arrange in this way, but other people might prefer?

I think the dictionary's sample sentence is rather unnatural. To set something up usually means "to put something into a pre-defined order," as in setting up the pieces in a chess set.
 

jutfrank

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set up carries the meaning of arranging things in preparation for something that is coming next. You want to do something with this arrangement.

set up a business
set up a system
set up some software
set up a game


It also carries the meaning:
To set something up usually means "to put something into a pre-defined order," as in setting up the pieces in a chess set.

The dictionary example fails to get across either of those uses and so, in my view, fails as a useful example.
 

jutfrank

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Then this dictionary is wrong

Set up:put into a proper or systematic order
"set up the books on the shelves in chronological order";

http://www.wordwebonline.com/search.pl?w=arrange

Hold on -- I've just looked at the link. It does not say what you quote!

It actually says "arrange the books on the shelves in chronological order", which is a very good example of the verb arrange. I think you may be reading that dictionary in the wrong way.
 

hhtt21

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hhtt21

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set up carries the meaning of arranging things in preparation for something that is coming next. You want to do something with this arrangement.

set up a business
set up a system
set up some software
set up a game


It also carries the meaning:

The dictionary example fails to get across either of those uses and so, in my view, fails as a useful example.
The dictionary example can imply pre-defined order but not imply preparation, as you referred to. This is my idea.

Thank you.
 
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hhtt21

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It also carries the meaning:
The dictionary example fails to get across either of those uses and so, in my view, fails as a useful example.

I try to understand this post better so, would you please explain get across: what it means, for example?

Thank you.
 
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