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    • Join Date: Apr 2008
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    #1

    from that of

    Dear Friends,

    I wonder if "from that of" can be used in the folowing:

    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from that of Lakoff’s (2005) pragmato-semantic conception.

    Thank you very much for your help.

    Palinkasocsi


    • Join Date: Jul 2006
    • Posts: 2,886
    #2

    Re: from that of

    Quote Originally Posted by palinkasocsi View Post
    Dear Friends,

    I wonder if "from that of" can be used in the folowing:

    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from that of Lakoff’s (2005) pragmato-semantic conception.

    Thank you very much for your help.

    Palinkasocsi
    While I have not the foggiest idea what this sentence means, I will endeavour to help amend it. That does not augur well, does it?
    I would wipe out 'that of'. The sentence is ungrammatical as is.

    This sounds better:
    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from that(=cog. sem. approach) of Lakoff’s (2005) in his pragmato-semantic conception.


    • Join Date: Jul 2009
    • Posts: 2,036
    #3

    Smile Re: from that of

    Quote Originally Posted by palinkasocsi View Post
    Dear Friends,

    I wonder if "from that of" can be used in the folowing:

    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from that of Lakoff’s (2005) pragmato-semantic conception.

    Thank you very much for your help.

    Palinkasocsi
    Using "from that of" instead of just "from" adds emphasis. It emphasizes, or states in a stronger way, that this "approach" is "Lakoff's approach". In the phrase "from that of" 'of' is used to show possession, and in this way emphasizes the possessor, who in this sentence is Lakoff.

    "from that of" - Google Search

    Last edited by PROESL; 15-Aug-2009 at 18:48. Reason: error


    • Join Date: Jul 2006
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    #4

    Re: from that of

    Quote Originally Posted by PROESL View Post
    PROESL,

    What is this link in aid of?

    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from that of Lakoff’s (2005) pragmato-semantic conception

    By replacing that with its referent, which is indefinite to me, this is what happens to the sentence:

    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from (previous cognitive semantic) approaches of Lakoff’s (2005) pragmato-semantic conception.

    Does the second sentence, the tail end of it, make sense to you? Not to me.


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    #5

    Re: from that of

    approach of a conception?


    • Join Date: Jul 2009
    • Posts: 2,036
    #6

    Smile Re: from that of

    Quote Originally Posted by svartnik View Post
    PROESL,

    What is this link in aid of?

    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from that of Lakoff’s (2005) pragmato-semantic conception

    By replacing that with its referent, which is indefinite to me, this is what happens to the sentence:

    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from (previous cognitive semantic) approaches of Lakoff’s (2005) pragmato-semantic conception.

    Does the second sentence, the tail end of it, make sense to you? Not to me.
    The link shows that "from that of" is used often, and it is correct. It's a common pattern, and it's correct in the example sentence at the begininng of this discussion. I would not use "of" by itself in the example sentence. However, "that of" works well. "That" refers to Lakoff's approach. But that's just an observation. It's simply correct to use "that of" in the example sentence. To quote the expression more directly here is "differs from that of": http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...2&aq=f&oq=&aqi=



    • Join Date: Jul 2006
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    #7

    Re: from that of

    Quote Originally Posted by PROESL View Post
    The link shows that "from that of" is used often, and it is correct.
    I do not think that any doubt regarding its grammaticality was ever lingering in anyone.


    Quote Originally Posted by PROESL View Post
    It's a common pattern,
    It was not ever in contention in this thread, IMO.

    Quote Originally Posted by PROESL View Post
    and it's correct in the example sentence at the begininng of this discussion. I would not use "of" by itself in the example sentence.,
    I never said I would.


    Quote Originally Posted by PROESL View Post
    "That" refers to Lakoff's approach. But that's just an observation. It's simply correct to use "that of" in the example sentence.
    Given that it is so, in

    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from that of Lakoff’s (2005) pragmato-semantic conception,

    what is the function of pragmato-semantic conception?

    What does the bolded fragment add to this part of the sentence?
    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from that of Lakoff’s

    What does 'approach of a concept' mean


    • Join Date: Jul 2009
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    #8

    Re: from that of

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by PROESL
    and it's correct in the example sentence at the begininng of this discussion. I would not use "of" by itself in the example sentence.,

    I never said I would.

    I know you never said that, but I saw a reposting of the example sentence in one of your previous posts, and it did not include "that", or maybe my eye glanced over it too fast, but I didn't see it.

    I've read the rest of your post, and I would then only be left with one question: Why would you advise the poster to leave out "that of"?

    Last edited by PROESL; 18-Aug-2009 at 05:41.


    • Join Date: Jul 2006
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    #9

    Re: from that of

    Quote Originally Posted by PROESL View Post
    Why would you advise the poster to leave out "that of"?
    Here goes nothing.

    This is the original sentence:

    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from that of Lakoff’s (2005) pragmato-semantic conception.

    Having read out loud the original sentence several times, I have to concede to your point. The sentence is okay. Sorry Pálinkasöcsi!
    One thing I do not see eye-to-eye with you: the referent of 'that': in my opinion it is just a grammatical filler with no semantic content.

    I will characterize metaphor in a framework which differs from previous cognitive semantic approaches and especially from that of Lakoff’s (2005) pragmato-semantic conception. =

    differs from:

    - previous cognitive semantic approaches
    - Lakoff's (previous) pragmato-semantic conception
    Last edited by svartnik; 15-Aug-2009 at 19:34.


    • Join Date: Apr 2008
    • Posts: 212
    #10

    Re: from that of

    Thanks Svartnik and PROESL.

    Palinkasocsi

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