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    • Join Date: Feb 2009
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    #1

    Do you use these?

    Dear Teachers,

    You wanna(want to) let me help you?
    Do you wanna(want to) let me help you?
    Would you wanna(want to) let me help you?

    Do these sentences make any sense?
    If they do, are they used commonly?

    Appreciate your help.


    • Join Date: Sep 2009
    • Posts: 422
    #2

    Re: Do you use these?

    Quote Originally Posted by bouji View Post
    Dear Teachers,

    You wanna(want to) let me help you?
    Do you wanna(want to) let me help you?
    Would you wanna(want to) let me help you?

    Do these sentences make any sense?
    If they do, are they used commonly?

    Appreciate your help.

    Absolutely, Bouji. In everyday speech most words, especially verb phrases undergo these changes.

    There was an excellent book put out years ago that illustrated all the ways we use language in fast speech.

    I - you -we - they wanna/he - she wansta/

    hafta/hasta

    coulda/woulda/maya/mighta

    needta/needsta

    There are many many more.

  1. bhaisahab's Avatar
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    #3

    Re: Do you use these?

    Quote Originally Posted by bouji View Post
    Dear Teachers,

    You wanna(want to) let me help you?
    Do you wanna(want to) let me help you?
    Would you wanna(want to) let me help you?

    Do these sentences make any sense?
    If they do, are they used commonly?

    Appreciate your help.
    As albeit has said, you will commonly hear them. In answer to your question, "Do you use these?" No, I don't.


    • Join Date: Sep 2009
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    #4

    Re: Do you use these?

    Quote Originally Posted by bhaisahab View Post
    As albeit has said, you will commonly hear them. In answer to your question, "Do you use these?" No, I don't.
    Everyone but a robot compresses their speech and in systematic ways.

    [paraphrase S Pinker]

    You have a choice, sound like a natural speaker of English or sound like a recording of the queen of England.

  2. bhaisahab's Avatar
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    #5

    Re: Do you use these?

    Quote Originally Posted by albeit View Post
    Everyone but a robot compresses their speech and in systematic ways.

    [paraphrase S Pinker]

    You have a choice, sound like a natural speaker of English or sound like a recording of the queen of England.
    Of course everyone compresses their speech, but there are degrees of compression.

  3. Raymott's Avatar
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    #6

    Re: Do you use these?

    Quote Originally Posted by albeit View Post
    Everyone but a robot compresses their speech and in systematic ways.

    [paraphrase S Pinker]

    You have a choice, sound like a natural speaker of English or sound like a recording of the queen of England.
    Yes, but if this is what the OP means, then he has only represented the verb this way.
    "wanna" is a phonemic spelling. Why not the rest?
    If someone is going to say "wanna", they are likely to say something like:
    "Ya wanna lepme help ya" or lots of other sentences that try to represent the actually sounds.
    It's unlikely that anyone would actually pronounce all the other words as written and only 'want to' as 'wanna'.
    Given that this is not a phonemic rendering, the correct way to write "wanna" is "want to".


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    #7

    Re: Do you use these?

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymott View Post
    Yes, but if this is what the OP means, then he has only represented the verb this way.
    "wanna" is a phonemic spelling. Why not the rest?
    If someone is going to say "wanna", they are likely to say something like:
    "Ya wanna lepme help ya" or lots of other sentences that try to represent the actually sounds.
    It's unlikely that anyone would actually pronounce all the other words as written and only 'want to' as 'wanna'.
    Given that this is not a phonemic rendering, the correct way to write "wanna" is "want to".
    I think that it's preeeeetty clear that that was/is what Bouji means, Raymott.

    But I agree completely, fully, in every way possible, why not the rest!

    [I'm confused by what appears to be a contradiction above, Ray, both underlined.]

    But beyond that, this has nothing to do with "correct"; we're not talking about writing or spelling. We're talking about a way to give ESLs a chance to experience how native speakers often actually speak.

    Verbs are often the first thing to be reduced, note the contracted forms of all verbs; these are the standard for speech Uncontracted verbs are unnatural and hold other meanings beyond the normal neutral.

    I've had young kids who we first showed the "writing" form of language to and then we told them that that's not how we normally speak and we gave them, in chunks, the reduced forms. They loved it, they engaged in much much more extensive use of these speech patterns and therefore much much much more practice because the sounds are so natural, so easy, so much fun.

    They sounded like little native speakers. Using these natural speech patterns made it more difficult for them to inject mother tongue influences.

    And 'yes' & 'no', fuggetaboudit --> unhuh/unun; yup/nope; yeah/naah.
    Last edited by albeit; 23-Sep-2009 at 05:48.

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    #8

    Re: Do you use these?

    Quote Originally Posted by albeit View Post
    I think that it's preeeeetty clear that that was/is what Bouji means, Raymott.

    But I agree completely, fully, in every way possible, why not the rest!

    [I'm confused by what appears to be a contradiction above, Ray, both underlined.]

    Surely not. It means that "wanna" is phonemic, but the whole sentence is not a phonemic transcription. The second underlined sentence refers to then whole sentence. Why choose one word from the sentence to render phonemically? That's the gist of what I said.


    But beyond that, this has nothing to do with "correct"; we're not talking about writing or spelling. We're talking about a way to give ESLs a chance to experience how native speakers often actually speak.

    It might be what you are talking about. The OP asked a question about syntax and incidentally gave an alternate spelling for one of the words. Surely that's an invitation to talk about spelling?


    <Charming story about teaching read, enjoyed and deleted.>
    By the way, bouji, to answer the question you actually asked, "Would you want to let me help you?" is not common used. The only situations I can imagine that sentence spoken in are rather contrived.
    It seems that albeit was in so much haste to supply you with other unorthodox spellings that he forgot about your question.


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    #9

    Re: Do you use these?

    Albeit wrote:[I'm confused by what appears to be a contradiction above, Ray, both underlined.]

    Raymott: Surely not. It means that "wanna" is phonemic, but the whole sentence is not a phonemic transcription. The second underlined sentence refers to then whole sentence. Why choose one word from the sentence to render phonemically? That's the gist of what I said.

    Thanks, Ray, now I understand.

    Albeit:
    But beyond that, this has nothing to do with "correct"; we're not talking about writing or spelling. We're talking about a way to give ESLs a chance to experience how native speakers often actually speak.


    Raymott: It might be what you are talking about. The OP asked a question about syntax and incidentally gave an alternate spelling for one of the words. Surely that's an invitation to talk about spelling?

    You don't need an invitation to talk about anything you feel is pertinent, Ray. But how is it pertinent to describe the correct spelling of what are words that can't be transcribed with the correct spelling.

    It wouldn't have made much sense for Bouji to have asked,


    =========
    You want to let me help you?
    Do you want to let me help you?
    Would you want to let me help you?

    Do these sentences make any sense?
    If they do, are they used commonly?

    ===================


    Quote Originally Posted by Raymott View Post
    By the way, bouji, to answer the question you actually asked, "Would you want to let me help you?" is not common used. The only situations I can imagine that sentence spoken in are rather contrived.
    It seems that albeit was in so much haste to supply you with other unorthodox spellings that he forgot about your question.
    I'd say that in the context that Bouji's given the 'would' use is not that common. But I think that it certainly could be used.

    Results 1 - 10 of about 516,000,000 English pages for "would you want to let me".


    • Join Date: Jul 2009
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    #10

    Re: Do you use these?

    Quote Originally Posted by bouji View Post
    Dear Teachers,

    You wanna(want to) let me help you?
    Do you wanna(want to) let me help you?
    Would you wanna(want to) let me help you?

    Do these sentences make any sense?
    If they do, are they used commonly?

    Appreciate your help.
    Yes, they make sense as conversational English spoken in an informal register, which is the case with a lot of conversational English, that being it takes an informal tone. Much of our daily language is, in fact, informal, and, therefore, we regularly hear the type of expressions you've asked about here.

    I would consider using full sentences (not dropping auxiliaries such as "do") and not using spoken contractions such as "wanna" in situations where it seems obvious that a more formal tone is required. Spoken contractions and other such forms of relaxed speech indicate familiarity to different degrees. Expressing too much familiarity could be offensive in a situation that requires a more formal tone. So these spoken expressions you're asking about are typical and okay, but be aware of times and places in which they may not be okay.

    They're commonly used every day by many native speakers of English of all types from all backgrounds. They can't be avoided. In case there's disagreement here from other native speakers of English, I'll simply maintain that this is absolutely true in American English - no doubt about it.

    There's just one thing. This sentence "Would you wanna(want to) let me help you?" seems a bit odd to me. I don't think that "wanna" often follows "would" in this way. It's logical in the context of what you're asking about, but to me, it doesn't sound like the most familiar expression. It's possible, however.
    Last edited by PROESL; 23-Sep-2009 at 07:56.

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