Results 1 to 9 of 9
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • Chinese
      • Home Country:
      • China
      • Current Location:
      • China

    • Join Date: Nov 2003
    • Posts: 2,715
    #1

    when

    Dear teachers,

    It is not u ntil it was getting dark_______ the child remembered to go back home.
    a. when b. that
    The key is "a". But the structure of emphatic sentence is:

    It is ....that .....
    It is ....who......
    Could you please explain why ''a'' is correct? Or is it a mistake?

    Looking forward to hearing from you.
    Thank you in advance.

    Jiang

    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • Oriya
      • Home Country:
      • India
      • Current Location:
      • India

    • Join Date: Mar 2008
    • Posts: 2,121
    #2

    Exclamation Re: when

    Quote Originally Posted by jiang View Post
    Dear teachers,

    It is not u ntil it was getting dark_______ the child remembered to go back home.
    a. when b. that
    The key is "a". But the structure of emphatic sentence is:

    It is ....that .....
    It is ....who......
    Could you please explain why ''a'' is correct? Or is it a mistake?

    Looking forward to hearing from you.
    Thank you in advance.

    Jiang
    Here 'b' is correct. Let us rearrange the sentence:
    It is not that the child remembered to go back home, until it was getting dark.(In fact he wanted to go back before sun-set.)


    • Join Date: Nov 2009
    • Posts: 191
    #3

    Re: when

    It is was not until it was getting dark that the child remembered to go back home.

  1. euncu's Avatar
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • Turkish
      • Home Country:
      • Turkey
      • Current Location:
      • Turkey

    • Join Date: Aug 2009
    • Posts: 1,314
    #4

    Re: when

    Quote Originally Posted by sarat_106 View Post
    Here 'b' is correct.
    I 'm clueless about your answer since "a" seems correct to me

  2. Barb_D's Avatar
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • American English
      • Home Country:
      • United States
      • Current Location:
      • United States

    • Join Date: Mar 2007
    • Posts: 19,221
    #5

    Re: when

    If it's just a straight-forward statement, then when would be okay: It was getting dark when the child remembered to go home. It was September when the truth was revealed at last. It was 10 when the doctor finally saw me for my 8:30 appointment.

    However, the structure "It was not until X" requires the "that."

    It was not until it was getting dark that...
    It wasn't until September that...
    It wasn't until 10 that....
    I'm not a teacher, but I write for a living. Please don't ask me about 2nd conditionals, but I'm a safe bet for what reads well in (American) English.

    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • Chinese
      • Home Country:
      • China
      • Current Location:
      • China

    • Join Date: Nov 2003
    • Posts: 2,715
    #6

    Re: when

    Dear Barb_D,

    Thank you very much for your explanation.
    Could you please kindly explain how to distinguish a "straight-forward" statement and an emphatic sentence?
    For example, do you mean in the following sentence if it is in negative form then both are correct?
    It was getting dark when the child remembered to go home.
    But emphatic sentences are not necessarily negative sentence.
    Or do you mean if it is a statement then the two choice "when" and "that" won't be put together as choices?

    Looking forward to hearing from you.
    Thank you in advance.

    jiang

    Quote Originally Posted by Barb_D View Post
    If it's just a straight-forward statement, then when would be okay: It was getting dark when the child remembered to go home. It was September when the truth was revealed at last. It was 10 when the doctor finally saw me for my 8:30 appointment.

    However, the structure "It was not until X" requires the "that."

    It was not until it was getting dark that...
    It wasn't until September that...
    It wasn't until 10 that....

  3. Soup's Avatar
    VIP Member
    English Teacher
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • Canada
      • Current Location:
      • China

    • Join Date: Sep 2007
    • Posts: 5,882
    #7

    Re: when

    We know that when modifies a noun of time:


    • It was midnight when the child remembered to go home.
    • Midnight was when the child remembered to go home.
    The question is, does when work here?


    • It wasn't until midnight when the child remembered to go home.

    That is, can the when-clause look inside the preposition phrase until midnight and modify the noun midnight? The answer is No. It cannot.

    _________________________

    But then, why is (b) that correct? The answer is in the subject's referent:


    • It wasn't until midnight that the child remembered.
    • That the child remembered wasn't until midnight.
    • When the child remembered wasn't until midnight.



    Hope that helps.

    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • Chinese
      • Home Country:
      • China
      • Current Location:
      • China

    • Join Date: Nov 2003
    • Posts: 2,715
    #8

    Re: when

    Dear Soup,

    Thank you very much for your explanation.
    I still feel it confusing. To me the difference is "not". Can I understand it this way:
    When the child remembered to go home was midnight.
    Looking forward to hearing from you.
    Thank you in advance.
    Have a nice weekend.
    Jiang
    Quote Originally Posted by Soup View Post
    We know that when modifies a noun of time:

    • It was midnight when the child remembered to go home.
    • Midnight was when the child remembered to go home.
    The question is, does when work here?

    • It wasn't until midnight when the child remembered to go home.
    That is, can the when-clause look inside the preposition phrase until midnight and modify the noun midnight? The answer is No. It cannot.

    _________________________

    But then, why is (b) that correct? The answer is in the subject's referent:


    • It wasn't until midnight that the child remembered.
    • That the child remembered wasn't until midnight.
    • When the child remembered wasn't until midnight.


    Hope that helps.

  4. Soup's Avatar
    VIP Member
    English Teacher
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • Canada
      • Current Location:
      • China

    • Join Date: Sep 2007
    • Posts: 5,882
    #9

    Re: when

    Quote Originally Posted by jiang View Post
    To me the difference is "not". Can I understand it this way: When the child remembered to go home was midnight.
    Your original example sentence reads like this: the child remembered to go back home, but not until it was too late as it/the sky was getting dark. In other words, by the time the child remembered to go back home the sky was getting dark.


    ________________________


    [1] When has several functions, one of which it to express at the time of <event>,


    • It was cold when I woke up this morning.
    • When I woke up this morning it was cold.
      • At the time of waking up, it was cold.


    [2] Another function of when is to tell us which action happened first:


    • I turned on the heater when I woke up.
    • When I woke up I turned on the heater.
      • 1st event: I woke up
      • 2nd event: I turned on the heater

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •