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  1. Offroad's Avatar
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    #1

    infinitive 'to'

    Dear friends...

    Could you please shed some light on this?

    I am (or have I always been?) confused about when (to) use the infinitive:

    a dictonary defines 'slough' as being:

    to have a layer of skin come off.

    eg: Snakes slough their skin regularly.

    Something keeps telling me that a 'to' is missing between 'skin' and 'come off'. Or... is 'come off' a noun?

    slough = to have a layer of skin to come off.

    Many thanks

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    #2

    Re: infinitive 'to'

    Quote Originally Posted by Offroad View Post
    Dear friends...

    Could you please shed some light on this?

    I am (or have I always been?) confused about when to use the infinitive: "to" is required.

    a dictonary defines 'slough' as being:

    to have a layer of skin come off.

    eg: Snakes slough their skin regularly.

    Something keeps telling me that a 'to' is missing between 'skin' and 'come off'. No, you don't want a "to" there.

    Or... is 'come off' a noun? No, "come" is a verb.

    slough = to have a layer of skin to come off.

    Many thanks
    2006
    Last edited by 2006; 31-May-2010 at 06:19. Reason: change colour

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    #3

    Re: infinitive 'to'

    Quote Originally Posted by Offroad View Post
    Dear friends...

    Could you please shed some light on this?

    I am (or have I always been?) confused about when (to) use the infinitive:

    a dictonary defines 'slough' as being:

    to have a layer of skin come off.

    eg: Snakes slough their skin regularly.

    Something keeps telling me that a 'to' is missing between 'skin' and 'come off'. Or... is 'come off' a noun?

    slough = to have a layer of skin to come off.

    Many thanks
    ***** NOT A TEACHER *****

    Good morning, Offroad.

    (1) Mesdames Celce-Murcia and Larsen-Freeman in their excellent

    The Grammar Book explain that the "to" is not used after certain

    causative verbs such as "make" and "have."

    (a) These are my examples (not the ladies'):

    I MADE him STAY home until he cleaned up his room.

    He HAD the gardener PLANT some roses.

    (2) Perhaps you already know that "help" may or may not take

    a "to": it's your choice:

    Would you kindly help me (to) understand this sentence?

    *****

    Have a nice day!

  2. Offroad's Avatar
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    #4

    Re: infinitive 'to'

    Quote Originally Posted by TheParser View Post

    (1) Mesdames Celce-Murcia and Larsen-Freeman in their excellent

    The Grammar Book explain that the "to" is not used after certain

    causative verbs such as "make" and "have."

    He HAD the gardener PLANT some roses.
    Many thanks The Parser!

    He had the gardener (to) plant some roses. Hmm... I really miss the "to" here!! As in:

    They got the pretty brunette-girl to dance with this mini-skirt.
    Ellen got Obama to dance in her show!
    John had his cousin to fix his stereo for free!

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    #5

    Re: infinitive 'to'

    SWAN, PEU (1995) 223, p200

    get + past participle: get washed, dressed, married etc

    Get can be used with a past participle. This structure often has a reflexive meaning, to talk about things that we do to ourselves. Common expressions are get washed, get dressed, get lost, get drowned, get engaged, etc.

    You have five minutes to get dressed.
    She is getting married in June.

    5. passive auxiliary: He got caught
    Get + past participle is also used to make passive structures, in the same way as be + past participle.
    He got caught by the police driving at 120mph.
    This structure is mostly used in informal style, and is not often used to talk about longer, more deliberate, planned actions.

    Our house got built in 1827.
    Parliament got opened on Thursday.

    get ...ing; get infinitive
    Get ...ing is sometimes used informally to mean 'start ...ing', especially in the expressions get moving, get going.
    We had better get moving - it is late.
    With an infinitive, get can mean 'manage', 'have an opportunity' or 'be allowed'.

    We did not get to see her -- did not manage; did not have the opportunity
    When do I get to meet your new boyfriend? -- be allowed, have the opportunity
    Get + infinitive can also suggest gradual development:
    He is nice when you get to know him.
    You will get to speak English more easily as time goes by.
    HE is getting to be a lovely kid.

    224 get (2): + OBJECT + VERB FORM
    1. causative: Do not get him talking
    Get + object + ...ing means 'make somebody/something start ...ing'.
    Do not get him talking about you.
    Once we got the heater going the car started to warm up.

    2. causative: Get Penny to help us
    Get + object + infinitive means 'make somebody/something do something' or persuade somebody to do something: there is often an idea of difficulty.
    I can't get that child to go to bed.
    See if you can get the car to start.

    3. causative: get something done
    Get + object + past participle can mean 'cause something to be done by somebody else'. The past participle has a passive meaning.
    I must get my watch repaired. (= I want my watch to be repaired)

    4. experience: We got our roof blown off
    Get + object + past participle can sometimes be used in the sense of experience.
    This idea is more often expressed with have.

    5. Get the children dressed
    We can also use get + object + past participle to talk about completing work on something.
    It will take me another hour to get the washing done.
    After you have got the children dressed, can you make the beds?

    238 have (5): + object + verb form

    Have can be followed by object + infinitive (without to), object + -ing, and object + past participle.

    1. causative: have somebody do/doing something
    have + object + infinitive can mean "cause somebody to do something'. This is mostly used in AmE, to talk about giving instructions or orders.
    I am ready to see Mr Smith. HAve him come in, please.
    The manager had everybody fill out a form.
    The structure with an -ing form can mean 'cause somebody to be doing something'.
    He had us laughing all through the meal.

    2. causative: have something done
    have + object + past participle can mean 'cause something to be done by somebody else'. The past participle has passive meaning
    I must have/get my watch repaired (= I want my watch to be repaired)
    I am going to have/get my hair cut.
    If you do not get out of my house, I will have/get you arrested.

    3. experience: have something happen/happening
    In the structure have + object + infinitive/...-ing, have can mean experience.
    I had a very strange thing happen to me.
    We had a gipsy come to the door yesterday.
    It is lovely to have children playing in the garden.
    I looked up and found we had water dripping through the ceiling.
    Note the difference between the infinitive in the first two examples (for things that happened), and the -ing form in the last two (for things that are/were happening). This is like the difference between simple and progressive tenses.

    4. experience: We have/got our roof blown off
    Get + object + past participle can sometimes be used in the sense of experience.
    This idea is more often expressed with have.

    5. I won't have...
    I won't have + object + veb form can mean 'I won't allow...'
    I won't have you telling me what to do.
    I won't have my house turned into a hotel.

    -------------------

    to have a layer of skin come off.
    =

    4. experience: We have/got our roof blown off
    Get + object + past participle can sometimes be used in the sense of experience.
    This idea is more often expressed with have.

    (come = past participle) come --came --come

    He had the gardener (to) plant some roses. Hmm... I really miss the "to" here!!
    Do not miss the 'to'. With it the sentence is not grammatical. Remember:

    1. causative: have somebody do/doing something
    have + object + infinitive can mean "cause somebody to do something'. This is mostly used in AmE, to talk about giving instructions or orders.
    I am ready to see Mr Smith. HAve him come in, please.
    The manager had everybody fill out a form.
    The structure with an -ing form can mean 'cause somebody to be doing something'.
    He had us laughing all through the meal.

    As in:

    They got the pretty brunette-girl to dance with this mini-skirt.
    Ellen got Obama to dance in her show!
    John had his cousin to fix his stereo for free!
    Remember:
    2. causative: Get Penny to help us
    Get + object + infinitive means 'make somebody/something do something' or persuade somebody to do something: there is often an idea of difficulty.
    I can't get that child to go to bed.
    See if you can get the car to start.

  4. Offroad's Avatar
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    #6

    Re: infinitive 'to'

    Very nice...

    I am working on it. Be right back (BRB)

  5. Offroad's Avatar
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    #7

    Re: infinitive 'to'

    Back...
    1. causative: have somebody do/doing something
    have + object + infinitive can mean "cause somebody to do something'. This is mostly used in AmE, to talk about giving instructions or orders.

    I am ready to see Mr Smith. Have him come in, please.
    The manager had everybody fill out a form.

    He HAD the gardener PLANT some roses
    Well... what else can I do? I have to agree.

    One last question: Has anyone ever used the infinitive this way in other countries? UK? Canada?

    Many thanks.

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    #8

    Re: infinitive 'to'

    Quote Originally Posted by Offroad View Post
    Back...
    Well... what else can I do? I have to agree.

    One last question: Has anyone ever used the infinitive this way in other countries? UK? Canada?

    Many thanks.
    IMO fairly common usage

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