Teachers' problem

Status
Not open for further replies.

motico

Member
Joined
May 6, 2010
Member Type
Student or Learner
Native Language
Hebrew
Home Country
Israel
Current Location
Israel
Thank you for checking the paragraph below:

My decision just became stronger after I had turned directly to one of the officials in the Ministry of Education in charge of that plan, complaining about the discrimination. The official's answer had been: "I'm sorry that it isn't possible to pay all the teachers higher salaries, however, the position you hold includes some advantages that can't be found in this special plan". As she hadn't elaborated, it is unclear what advantages she had had in mind. Personally, I tend to believe that those advantages simply do not exist…
 

motico

Member
Joined
May 6, 2010
Member Type
Student or Learner
Native Language
Hebrew
Home Country
Israel
Current Location
Israel
I would appreciate if someone could check the paragraph below. Thank you.




My decision just became stronger after I had turned directly to one of the officials in the Ministry of Education in charge of that plan, complaining about the discrimination. The official's answer had been: "I'm sorry , it isn't possible to pay all the teachers higher salaries, however, the position you hold includes some advantages that can't be found in this special plan". As she hadn't elaborated, it is unclear what advantages she had had in mind. Personally, I tend to believe that those advantages simply do not exist…
 

billmcd

Key Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2009
Member Type
English Teacher
Native Language
English
Home Country
United States
Current Location
United States
Your first sentence doesn't make it clear that you are complaining, although the follow on sentences do. See some of my suggestions below.


My decision just became stronger after I had turned and complained about discrimination directly to one of the officials in the Ministry of Education in charge of that plan. [STRIKE]the[/STRIKE] The official's answer had been: "I'm sorry that it isn't possible to pay all the teachers higher salaries, however, the position you hold includes some advantages that can't be found in this special plan". [STRIKE]As[/STRIKE]Because she hadn't elaborated, it [STRIKE]is[/STRIKE]was unclear what advantages she had had in mind. Personally, I tend to believe that those advantages simply do not exist…
 
Last edited:

crazYgeeK

Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2010
Member Type
Student or Learner
Native Language
Vietnamese
Home Country
Vietnam
Current Location
Vietnam
Why can't the "As" above be used instead of "Because" ?
 

motico

Member
Joined
May 6, 2010
Member Type
Student or Learner
Native Language
Hebrew
Home Country
Israel
Current Location
Israel
Thank you!
Since all the verbs which come after "became" ("My decision just became stronger"), come in the Past Perfect Tense (because they had taken place before my decision became stronger…), why shouldn't "was" (according to your correction) in the sentence: "It was unclear what advantages she had had in mind" - be corrected to "had been"? ("It had been unclear…")
 

Raymott

VIP Member
Joined
Jun 29, 2008
Member Type
Academic
Native Language
English
Home Country
Australia
Current Location
Australia
Thank you!
Since all the verbs which come after "became" ("My decision just became stronger"), come in the Past Perfect Tense (because they had taken place before my decision became stronger…), why shouldn't "was" (according to your correction) in the sentence: "It was unclear what advantages she had had in mind" - be corrected to "had been"? ("It had been unclear…")
To me, your paragraph could do without any instances of the past perfect. They are obtrusive and unnecessary.
We already know your decision became stronger after all this happened, because you've told us.
"My decision just became stronger after I ..."
In fact, using the past perfect for the official's answer - "The official's answer had been: ..." - brings up the possibility that this occurred before you turned to the official.
The official gave you an answer; your decision became stronger; you turned to the official to complain of the discrimination.

There is no rule saying that you need to use the past perfect to describe previous events simply because you've used the simple past once. If there was, there would be no way to tell the time sequence of all the clauses written in the past perfect.
 

Raymott

VIP Member
Joined
Jun 29, 2008
Member Type
Academic
Native Language
English
Home Country
Australia
Current Location
Australia
Thank you for checking the paragraph below:

My decision just became stronger after I [STRIKE]had [/STRIKE]turned directly to one of the officials in the Ministry of Education in charge of that plan, complaining about the discrimination. The official's answer to my complaint [this establishes the time connection between your complaining and the official's answer] was: "I'm sorry that it isn't possible to pay all the teachers higher salaries, however, the position you hold includes some advantages that can't be found in this special plan". As she didn't elaborate, it is unclear what advantages she had in mind. Personally, I tend to believe that those advantages simply do not exist…

I can't see any ambiguity of timing here.
R.
 

motico

Member
Joined
May 6, 2010
Member Type
Student or Learner
Native Language
Hebrew
Home Country
Israel
Current Location
Israel

billmcd

Key Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2009
Member Type
English Teacher
Native Language
English
Home Country
United States
Current Location
United States
"As" instead of "Because" is OK but I prefer "Because".
 

billmcd

Key Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2009
Member Type
English Teacher
Native Language
English
Home Country
United States
Current Location
United States
Thank you!

Since all the verbs which come after "became" ("My decision just became stronger"), come in the Past Perfect Tense (because they had taken place before my decision became stronger…), why shouldn't "was" (according to your correction) in the sentence: "It was unclear what advantages she had had in mind" - be corrected to "had been"? ("It had been unclear…")

Either the past perfect or simple past can be used when the cause and effect/result are close in time.
 

motico

Member
Joined
May 6, 2010
Member Type
Student or Learner
Native Language
Hebrew
Home Country
Israel
Current Location
Israel
Either the past perfect or simple past can be used when the cause and effect/result are close in time.

I'm beginning to learn… Thank you, both of you, billmcd and Raymott!
 

tedtmc

Key Member
Joined
Jun 12, 2006
Member Type
Interested in Language
Native Language
Chinese
Home Country
Malaysia
Current Location
Malaysia
You use the past perfect tense only if you need to distinguish an action/event in the past before another action in the past.
There is no need to do that here so the simple past is more appropriate.
 

motico

Member
Joined
May 6, 2010
Member Type
Student or Learner
Native Language
Hebrew
Home Country
Israel
Current Location
Israel
You use the past perfect tense only if you need to distinguish an action/event in the past before another action in the past.
There is no need to do that here so the simple past is more appropriate.
I understand. Thank you! The past simple has won the vast majority...
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top