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    #1

    Abstract Noun Phrase

    Today, I want to study the principle of the abstract noun phrase so, can any teacher explain me its principle. By the way, when you are giving me its principle I want you to be sure, although I get its principle but it confused me. After that I will do some exercises so get ready teachers.

    Is this principle is OK?
    The + playing + of + football

    But when there is a name or a pronoun, will it be like this?
    Peter's + playing + of + football
    His + Playing + of + football

    Does present perfect tense, past perfect tense, present perfect continuous tense, or past perfect continuous tense works well with this principle?

    Can we say:
    Peter's + playing + of + football + has been an exiting sport for him. / has made him happy.

    This thread is special to the teachers for clarification not students! This thread is for all

    Thank you in advance.
    Last edited by Atchan; 29-Jun-2010 at 21:39.

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    #2

    Re: Abstract Noun Phrase

    Atchan, some of the non-teachers on this board regularly give excellent answers to students' questions.

    It is in your own interest to show them some respect rather than exclude them from trying to help you.

    If their answers are wrong a teacher will soon put them right.

    Rover

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    #3

    Re: Abstract Noun Phrase

    Quote Originally Posted by Rover_KE View Post
    Atchan, some of the non-teachers on this board regularly give excellent answers to students' questions.

    It is in your own interest to show them some respect rather than exclude them from trying to help you.

    If their answers are wrong a teacher will soon put them right.

    Rover
    OK, this thread is for all. I know that there are clever students in this forum and I respect them, but I was scaring to give me fault principle, but now I can trust them although there are teachers.
    Last edited by Atchan; 29-Jun-2010 at 19:24.

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    #4

    Re: Abstract Noun Phrase

    Quote Originally Posted by atchan View Post
    OK, this thread is for all. I know that there are clever students in this forum and I respect them, but I was scaring to give me fault principle, but now I can trust them although there are teachers.
    ***** NOT A TEACHER *****

    Hello, Atchan.

    (1) I understand how you feel.

    (2) You are afraid that a non-teacher will give you a wrong answer

    and then you will be very confused.

    (3) Of course, you can always write something courteous such as:

    "I would greatly appreciate it if only teachers responded. Thank you."

    (4) Here is something else that you can do:

    (a) Before you read a post, look for "teacher" or "academic" in the upper

    right-hand corner. Or look for the words "moderator" or "editor." Those

    are language professionals.

    (b) If you see the words "NOT A TEACHER" or "student," you can do two

    things:

    (i) Be courteous and press the "thanks" button because s/he took time

    and effort to answer you.

    (ii) Then skip that post. = do not read that post; go to the next post.

    Then you will not have to worry that a non-teacher has maybe given

    you a wrong and confusing answer.

    ***** Thank you *****

    P.S. I have not tried to answer your grammar question, because it is

    too difficult for me. Hopefully, a teacher will soon answer your question.

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    #5

    Re: Abstract Noun Phrase

    Atchan's question has been helpfully answered here:

    Abstract Noun Phrase - WordReference Forums

    for those interested.

    Rover

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    #6

    Re: Abstract Noun Phrase

    Quote Originally Posted by atchan View Post
    Today, I want to study the principle of the abstract noun phrase so, can any teacher explain me its principle. By the way, when you are giving me its principle I want you to be sure, although I get its principle but it confused me. After that I will do some exercises so get ready teachers.

    Is this principle is OK?
    The + playing + of + football

    But when there is a name or a pronoun, will it be like this?
    Peter's + playing + of + football
    His + Playing + of + football

    Does present perfect tense, past perfect tense, present perfect continuous tense, or past perfect continuous tense works well with this principle?

    Can we say:
    Peter's + playing + of + football + has been an exiting sport for him. / has made him happy.

    This thread is special to the teachers for clarification not students! This thread is for all

    Thank you in advance.
    ***** NOT A TEACHER *****

    Hello, Atchan.

    (1) Teacher Rover was nice enough to give that link.

    (2) I studied it very carefully.

    (3) I learned a lot:

    (a) Yes, this principle does work with the different tenses.

    (b) "Peter's/His playing of football has been an exciting sport" is not

    correct because:

    (i) If you erase the words "of football," your sentence becomes:

    His playing has been an exciting sport. Of course, "playing" is not

    a sport. Football is the sport.


    (i) As one poster told you, you have a choice:

    (a) Peter's/His playing of football has become more frequent (playing is

    frequent) / Peter's playing of football is exciting for him (playing is

    exciting).

    (b) OR: Football is an exciting sport for him (football is sport).

    (4) I think that the MAIN THING to remember is that an noun like

    "playing" should NOT refer to a noun like "football."

    Playing is fun/ exciting/ tiring/ boring/necessary.

    Football is a sport/ game/ business.

    (5) And two posters told you that in American and in British English,

    it is more idiomatic (idiomatic = the way native speakers use the

    language) NOT to use "of." You will sound more like a native speaker

    if you say:

    Peter's playing football is becoming more and more frequent.

    (6) If you have more questions about this matter, just post them.

    Someone will be delighted to help you because we all know that you are

    a very serious and courteous student who wants to learn perfect English

    for your future career.

    ***** Thank you *****

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    #7

    Re: Abstract Noun Phrase

    Quote Originally Posted by TheParser View Post
    (a) Yes, this principle does work with the different tenses.
    I didn't understand what you mean. maybe you mean that it doesn't work with abstract noun phrase.

    Can I say: Tom's running behind his friend has been made him tired. (maybe right or not)
    Note: Here I'm not talking about my sentence, I'm talking about the principle.
    Can they work with this principle? Yes or No with some examples and clarification. Thanks

    Quote Originally Posted by TheParser View Post
    (5) And two posters told you that in American and in British English,

    it is more idiomatic (idiomatic = the way native speakers use the

    language) NOT to use "of." You will sound more like a native speaker

    if you say:

    Peter's playing football is becoming more and more frequent.
    Do you mean that it's not important but my dad said it's very important for this rule. Is it same if I use it or not?
    Last edited by Atchan; 30-Jun-2010 at 23:30.

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    #8

    Re: Abstract Noun Phrase

    Quote Originally Posted by atchan View Post
    I didn't understand what you mean. maybe you mean that it doesn't work with abstract noun phrase.

    Can I say: Tom's running behind his friend has been made him tired. (maybe right or not)
    Note: Here I'm not talking about my sentence, I'm talking about the principle.
    Can they work with this principle? Yes or No with some examples and clarification. Thanks


    Do you mean that it's not important but my dad said it's very important for this rule. Is it same if I use it or not?
    ***** NOT A TEACHER *****

    Hello, Atchan.

    (1) Hopefully, a teacher will soon answer your two questions.

    (2) As I type this, no one has answered yet, so I shall start.

    (3) In that link, one poster said this principle DOES work with various

    tenses, and the poster gave you 4 examples of has/became/will become/ and was becoming. (Please review that link that Teacher Rover gave us.)

    *****

    (4) I sincerely believe that "Peter's playing football" is "better" than

    "Peter's playing of football." In fact, maybe (maybe) some (many? most?)

    teachers would suggest that you NOT use "of." OF COURSE, you must be

    very respectful of your father. If he wants you to use it, then you should

    do so. But I think that most teachers would agree with the two posters

    in the link that "of" is definitely not idiomatic (that is, native speakers

    do not use it).

    ***** Thank you for your question *****

    P. S. Please continue to post questions about this matter until

    you find an answer that satisfies you. Many people here are happy

    to give you their views.

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    #9

    Re: Abstract Noun Phrase

    Quote Originally Posted by TheParser View Post
    ***** NOT A TEACHER *****

    Hello, Atchan.

    (1) Hopefully, a teacher will soon answer your two questions.

    (2) As I type this, no one has answered yet, so I shall start.

    (3) In that link, one poster said this principle DOES work with various

    tenses, and the poster gave you 4 examples of has/became/will become/ and was becoming. (Please review that link that Teacher Rover gave us.)


    ***** Thank you for your question *****

    P. S. Please continue to post questions about this matter until

    you find an answer that satisfies you. Many people here are happy

    to give you their views.
    I'm talking about...
    has /has been /had /had been
    I want you to do a sentence of each type of these tenses.

    Because when I use them during a sentence, it became strange to others.
    What relating to the other tenses, I know them very good.

    For me, I will not understand well until I do a sentences and examples of them.

    Thank you for your help

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    #10

    Re: Abstract Noun Phrase

    Quote Originally Posted by atchan View Post
    I'm talking about...
    has /has been /had /had been
    I want you to do a sentence of each type of these tenses.

    Because when I use them during a sentence, it became strange to others.
    What relating to the other tenses, I know them very good.

    For me, I will not understand well until I do a sentences and examples of them.

    Thank you for your help
    ***** NOT A TEACHER *****

    Hello, Atchan.

    (1) Thanks for the note.

    (2) I have a suggestion:

    Please start a new thread and give some sentences that you say

    sound strange to others. Then some of the wonderful teachers here

    will answer you. I will read your new thread with great interest because

    I want to see what the teachers tell you. I need to learn, too.

    ***** Thank you *****

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