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    #1

    Grammar.

    Is 'determine' in the following sentence a legitimate 'finite' verb? 'The men determine on another line of work.'
    Last edited by JIM1984; 17-Jan-2011 at 20:08. Reason: Punctuation

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    #2

    Re: Grammar.

    ***Not a teacher***

    Quote Originally Posted by JIM1984 View Post
    Is 'determine' in the following sentence a legitimate 'finite' verb? 'The men determine on another line of work.'
    'determine' in its own right is a finite verb here, although I don't think this is a legitimate use of it.

    You could say:
    'The men determine another line of work' - if they already have one or more lines of work and find another.
    Or:
    'The men decided upon another line of work' - sounds more as if they will do this instead of the one they are on at the moment.

    Does this answer your question?

    Ade

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    #3
    I may be wrong about this, and I have only, in the last couple of weeks, began a study of grammar, but as it is a finite verb, per se, then shouldn't that legitimize it ( in terms of rendering the sentence complete)? I'm not 100% about it however. Because, on the other hand, if one of the rules that goes towards qualifying a verb as finite is that it takes a tense, well 'determine' is ambigious. Thanks for your reply, but I'm really looking for a a precise analytical definition - one way or another.

    Could a teacher tell me if 'determine' in the following sentence is a legitimate 'finite verb' - 'The men determine on another line of work'. The reason I'm asking is that there appears to be a contradiction: with 'determine' a finite verb per se, but at the same time giving no indication of tense in the sentence, or at best an ambiguous sense of such! Come on boys!

    P.S. I've only in the last week or so began to teach myself the subject (grammar), so please bear with me!
    Last edited by Barb_D; 18-Jan-2011 at 01:33.

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    #4

    Re: Grammar.

    Quote Originally Posted by azcl View Post
    ***Not a teacher***



    'determine' in its own right is a finite verb here, although I don't think this is a legitimate use of it.

    You could say:
    'The men determine another line of work' - if they already have one or more lines of work and find another.
    Or:
    'The men decided upon another line of work' - sounds more as if they will do this instead of the one they are on at the moment.

    Does this answer your question?

    Ade
    I can't as yet work out the mechanics of this website, could you tell me if you got my reply. Just to say I've re-read your reply and it sounds valid.

  4. 5jj's Avatar
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    #5

    Re: Grammar.

    Quote Originally Posted by JIM1984 View Post
    Is 'determine' in the following sentence a legitimate 'finite' verb? 'The men determine on another line of work.'
    Sorry, Jim; the sentence is meaningless to me.

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    #6

    Re: Grammar.

    Quote Originally Posted by JIM1984 View Post
    I may be wrong about this, and I have only, in the last couple of weeks, began a study of grammar, but as it is a finite verb, per se, then shouldn't that legitimize it ( in terms of rendering the sentence complete)? I'm not 100% about it however. Because, on the other hand, if one of the rules that goes towards qualifying a verb as finite is that it takes a tense, well 'determine' is ambigious. Thanks for your reply, but I'm really looking for a a precise analytical definition - one way or another.
    ***Not a teacher***

    From the glossary on this website, the distinction between finite/non-finite verbs is made as follows.

    I go, she goes, he went - These verb forms are finite.
    To go, going - These verb forms are non-finite.

    So 'determine' is a finite verb in your post, as it can be inflected for tense/number etc - I determine, the men determine, she determined, he determines etc. So by ambiguous, do you mean that 'I determine' and 'the men determine' follows the same inflection pattern and is therefore 'ambiguous'?

    I'm afraid I'm also not sure what you mean by:
    ...but as it is a finite verb, per se, then shouldn't that legitimize it ( in terms of rendering the sentence complete)?
    If you could explain it in a different way, I would find it helpful.

    Thanks
    Ade

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    #7

    Re: Grammar.

    Thanks for your corrospondence

    What I meant, in terms of the verb 'determine' being ambiguous, was in the context of the sentence proffered, 'The men etc',. It is unclear, of itself, the verb, in the 'sentence' concerned, insofar as tense, person, and number. To be honest, I feel like I have went down a blind alley with this, and that it is probably best left alone. I understand precisely the definitions drawn on by yourself- I go, she goes, to go, going etc in terms of finite\non finite. I mean, just to use one's ear with regard to 'The men determine on another line of work' tells a person something is not quite right there. And, with another member replying to say he found the sentence meaningless, that's something, I think, which about gets things right! Bear in mind, I have undertook to study grammar, for the first time, only a week or so ago; I suppose, that which I was trying to figure out was why 'determine' ,purely and simply by and of itself, could not stand alone as a finite verb (without inflection or auxiliary verbs: I determined, he would determine etc). The irony of that though, as one thinks about it, is that if such were to have been the case, then one is left, in theory anyway , with a non-finite verb and no conjugation possible: I determine, you determine, he determine, we etc. I've just come from writing some poetry so maybe that's a tad culpable! So, like I say, a blind alley!

    Thanks

    Jim

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    #8

    Re: Grammar.

    Quote Originally Posted by fivejedjon View Post
    Sorry, Jim; the sentence is meaningless to me.
    I make you right with regard to your observation. I can't quiet get the hang of this website with regard to replies etc. I have to say I find it somewhat complicated. For example, with regard to the quote above, there didn't seem a facility where I could reply directly to fivejedjon, unlike when another member e-mailed me and the reply icon was available?? I'll just have to look around, I suppose! I mean I'm not even sure where this quote is going. And what about the icons in the message box, underline etc? What does this [strike] thing do? You highlight a word with all the best intentions and instead of maybe a spell check you get [strike] [strike]. Strike me is all I can say at the moment!

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    #9

    Re: Grammar.

    If you click on the QUOTE button at the bottom of this post, your reply message will begin with my message at the top, lodged between QUOTE and /QUOTE, both in square brackets, [......]. I can't put the square brackets round those two words now, or the 'and' between them will appear as
    and
    You can then delete any part of my message that you do not wish to quote.

    If you wish to break up my message into smaller quotes, with your comments in between, type QUOTE (in square brackets) at the beginning of each part and /QUOTE (again in square brackets) at the end.

    Write what you want, and then press Preview Post. Everything you have put in where I have told you will now appear
    like this.
    If it doesn't, you may have left out one of the brackets, forgotten the / in the second pair of brackets or inserted it in the first pair. Go back and correct this and preview again. When you have got it right, press Submit Reply and - Bingo!

    Once you have done it a couple of times, it becomes very easy.

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    #10

    Re: Grammar.

    I have done as you suggested and pressed the quote button. However when I pressed the Submit Reply button I received notification that my message was too short etc.Where exactly, when having pressed the QUOTE button, is one supposed to type their message before submitting it? Thanks for your advice and consideration. I'm assuming you're going to get this message at least and, If I haven't already, I'd like to say thanks also with regard to your assessment of my 'sentence', ' The men determined on another line of work', as meaningless! As I've communicated to a couple of other members I've tended to go down some blind alleys with regard to verbs, and now consider the best policy to keep things simple, insofar as that is possible! You should get this, shouldn't you? Here goes!

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