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    #1

    A few examples of putative should to discuss

    There are examples with "putative should" which I don't understand clearly. These are

    1) I'm surprised that he should say it to you.
    Questions
    a) Did he realy say something in the past?
    b) Am I surprised because I think he shouldn't have said it to you but he did?

    2) I prefer that she should drive.
    Questions
    a) Is it an example with putative should?

    3) What is the difference to your mind between -

    It's a pity if they should be so obstinate. - It's a pity that they should be so obstinate.

  1. bhaisahab's Avatar
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    #2

    Re: A few examples of putative should to discuss

    Quote Originally Posted by Kotfor View Post
    There are examples with "putative should" which I don't understand clearly. These are

    1) I'm surprised that he should say it to you.
    Questions
    a) Did he realy say something in the past?
    b) Am I surprised because I think he shouldn't have said it to you but he did? Yes.

    2) I prefer that she should drive.
    Questions
    a) Is it an example with putative should? It's a false subjunctive, an alternative to "I prefer that she drive".

    3) What is the difference to your mind between -

    It's a pity if they should be so obstinate. If it happens, it's a pity. - It's a pity that they should be so obstinate. They have been obstinate and it's a pity that they have.
    Bhai.

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    #3

    Re: A few examples of putative should to discuss

    Quote Originally Posted by bhaisahab View Post
    Bhai.
    Very interesting.
    From the previous post
    ---------------------------------
    3) What is the difference to your mind between -

    It's a pity if they should be so obstinate. If it happens, it's a pity.

    It's a pity that they should be so obstinate. - They have been obstinate and it's a pity that they have.
    ----------------------------------

    Could you explain why in the second sentence you see the reference to the past?

    What if we had "It's a pity that they should have been so obstinate."

    What would be the difference?

    PS My guess.

    It's a pity that they should be so obstinate. - They have been obstinate and it's a pity that they have.
    It's a pity that they should have been so obstinate. - They were not obstinate but if they had been it would be a pity.

    Can that be the case?
    Last edited by Kotfor; 25-Feb-2011 at 00:24.

  2. bhaisahab's Avatar
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    #4

    Re: A few examples of putative should to discuss

    PS My guess.

    It's a pity that they should be so obstinate. - They have been obstinate and it's a pity that they have.
    It's a pity that they should have been so obstinate. - They were not obstinate but if they had been it would be a pity. No, sorry, I'm afraid I confused you with my poor answer.
    To have that meaning it would have to be: "It would be a pity if they had been so obstinate.


    I'll revise what I said about #3: "It's a pity that they have been or are being so obstinate" depending on context.

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    #5

    Re: A few examples of putative should to discuss

    I see. So these two can mean completely the same thing

    It's a pity that they should be so obstinate.
    It's a pity that they should have been so obstinate.

    Is it the subjunctive mood here?

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