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  1. keannu's Avatar
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    #1

    to the need of protecting these sites.

    Is this "of " apposition as in "the city of seoul" or obejctive as in "The contruction of the dam"? They say it's apposition, but I think objective is closer to its meaning.

    ex) What the list aims to do is draw the world's attention to the need of protecting these sites. (the list is about world heritage site)

  2. keannu's Avatar
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    #2

    Re: to the need of protecting these sites.

    Isn't it objective?

  3. keannu's Avatar
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    #3

    Re: to the need of protecting these sites.

    Maybe my grammar term is too difficult to understand.

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    #4

    Re: to the need of protecting these sites.

    I don't understand it.

  4. keannu's Avatar
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    #5

    Re: to the need of protecting these sites.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rover_KE View Post
    I don't understand it.
    So far, in Korea we have learned there's 4 usages of "of"
    1. subjetive usage : "The arrival of spring" - means "spring arrives" as "of" connects spring to arrival as the subject for arrival
    2. objective usage : "the construction of the dam" - means "construct the dam" as "of" connects dam to construction as the object of the word "construction"
    3. equal(apposition) usage : "The city of Seoul" or "his effort of saving children" - these "of" make the former word equal to the latter word, so it's called apposition or equal usage
    4. possesive usage - "the pens and pencils of him"- this "of" makes the former word as the belongings of the latter word

    According to the 4 usages we learned, I think the "of" in "the need of protecting these sites" means objective usage as it can mean "the world's attention to need protecting these sites", but some one in Korea is arguing that it's an equal(apposition) usage like "the need that they have to protect these sites". That's why I'm confused.
    Are these four usages all Korean-made ones?
    Last edited by keannu; 05-Oct-2011 at 02:46.

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    #6

    Re:to the need of protecting these sites

    As a native speaker, I would not be using the word 'of'. I would say 'the need 'FOR' protectiing... '.

    As a digression - we would say 'his pens and pencils', not 'the pencils of him', although that is not necessarily wrong.

    Does this help?

  5. keannu's Avatar
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    #7

    Re: to the need of protecting these sites

    Quote Originally Posted by Whoknows View Post
    As a native speaker, I would not be using the word 'of'. I would say 'the need 'FOR' protectiing... '.

    As a digression - we would say 'his pens and pencils', not 'the pencils of him', although that is not necessarily wrong.

    Does this help?
    Don't you think it was written by a native speaker? Do native speakers never say in that way? Anyway, if "of" is possible in this sentence, which usage do you think it is?

  6. 5jj's Avatar
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    #8

    Re: to the need of protecting these sites.

    keannu: Are these four usages all Korean-made ones?
    5jj: I don't know about that, but I have not encountered them. There's nothing wrong with them, but I have managed all my life without them.

    Whoknows: As a native speaker, I would not be using the word 'of'. I would say 'the need 'FOR' protecting... '.

    keannu: Don't you think it was written by a native speaker? Do native speakers never say in that way?
    5jj: I wouldn't say 'never', but I wouldn't say'of'. I'd probably say, "the need to protect".
    keannu: Anyway, if "of" is possible in this sentence, which usage do you think it is?
    5jj. I suppose it's the apposition one.

  7. keannu's Avatar
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    #9

    Re: to the need of protecting these sites.

    Quote Originally Posted by fivejedjon View Post
    keannu: Are these four usages all Korean-made ones?
    5jj: I don't know about that, but I have not encountered them. There's nothing wrong with them, but I have managed all my life without them.

    Whoknows: As a native speaker, I would not be using the word 'of'. I would say 'the need 'FOR' protecting... '.
    keannu: Don't you think it was written by a native speaker? Do native speakers never say in that way?
    5jj: I wouldn't say 'never', but I wouldn't say'of'. I'd probably say, "the need to protect".
    keannu: Anyway, if "of" is possible in this sentence, which usage do you think it is?
    5jj. I suppose it's the apposition one.
    I'm so shocked you have manged without them, which I roughly guessed.
    In Korea, in so many questions of tests, these usages are dealt with, and become quite important issues, and I thought it must come from native speakers' grammar.

    But now I guess it's what Koreans made. Korean also has the same word for "of", but as you haven't cared about it for your lifetime, I can also mange without caring about Korean "of", if I focus on and analyze Korean "of", they will say "I'm crazy", but Korean grammarians may have created these usages for proper interpretations of writings.
    Last edited by keannu; 05-Oct-2011 at 05:43.

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    #10

    Re: to the need of protecting these sites.

    *** NOT A TEACHER ***
    Quote Originally Posted by keannu View Post
    4. possessive usage - "the pens and pencils of him"
    Shouldn't it read, (some) "pens and pencils of his"? (I replaced the definite article "the" with "some" in order to justify the use of this structure, instead of "his pens and pencils".)
    Eg., "He gave me some pens and pencils of his, and he also gave me his exercise book."

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