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  1. keannu's Avatar
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    #1

    To hear her play classical piano

    If you convert the underlined, will it be "If you hear her play classical piano" or "If you heard her play classical piano"? When a to-infinitive phrase is coupled with a hypothetical "would" main clause, does the to-infinitive phrase always have an unreal possibility or a real one? I also learned that conditionals have lots of mixtures of unreal+real or real+unreal, so it's confusing. I hope the readers of this can understand easily what I mean.

    ex)To hear her play classical piano, you wouldn't believe that she's blind. But 16-year-old Maria Esperanza lost her sight in an accident a few years ago. Doctors tried to save her vision, only to fail. But Maria overcame her loss. She says, "Never give up!" Next, she wants to learn jazz piano.

  2. keannu's Avatar
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    #2

    Re: To hear her play classical piano

    Quote Originally Posted by keannu View Post
    If you convert the underlined, will it be "If you hear her play classical piano" or "If you heard her play classical piano"? When a to-infinitive phrase is coupled with a hypothetical "would" main clause, does the to-infinitive phrase always have an unreal possibility or a real one? I also learned that conditionals have lots of mixtures of unreal+real or real+unreal, so it's confusing. I hope the readers of this can understand easily what I mean.

    ex)To hear her play classical piano, you wouldn't believe that she's blind. But 16-year-old Maria Esperanza lost her sight in an accident a few years ago. Doctors tried to save her vision, only to fail. But Maria overcame her loss. She says, "Never give up!" Next, she wants to learn jazz piano.
    Maybe the meaning is contextually determined....

  3. Raymott's Avatar
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    #3

    Re: To hear her play classical piano

    Quote Originally Posted by keannu View Post
    If you convert the underlined, will it be "If you hear her play classical piano" or "If you heard her play classical piano"? When a to-infinitive phrase is coupled with a hypothetical "would" main clause, does the to-infinitive phrase always have an unreal possibility or a real one? I also learned that conditionals have lots of mixtures of unreal+real or real+unreal, so it's confusing. I hope the readers of this can understand easily what I mean.

    ex)To hear her play classical piano, you wouldn't believe that she's blind. But 16-year-old Maria Esperanza lost her sight in an accident a few years ago. Doctors tried to save her vision, only to fail. But Maria overcame her loss. She says, "Never give up!" Next, she wants to learn jazz piano.
    You could write this as "If you heard her play ..." without losing much meaning.
    I'm not sure what you mean by 'convert' though.
    There's a real possibility of hearing her play. (What's an 'unreal possibility'?).
    If the girl is dead (therefore there is no possibility of hearing her, you'd have to say, "To hear her play classical piano, you wouldn't have believed that she was blind.

  4. keannu's Avatar
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    #4

    Re: To hear her play classical piano

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymott View Post
    You could write this as "If you heard her play ..." without losing much meaning.
    I'm not sure what you mean by 'convert' though.
    There's a real possibility of hearing her play. (What's an 'unreal possibility'?).
    If the girl is dead (therefore there is no possibility of hearing her, you'd have to say, "To hear her play classical piano, you wouldn't have believed that she was blind.
    If it is written as the if-clause form of "If you heard her play", the meaning is quite clear as "remote/unlikely possibility" conditional2.
    By unreal possibility, I meant future unlikely conditional that is unlikely to happen in the future as a remote possibility.

    So are you saying for to-infinitive that intends to make a conditional with "would" in the main clause, it can be interpreted in two ways of unlikely future or real possibility in the future? Or is it always unlikely future?
    By what you said below, do you mean "If you hear her play" is also possible?
    There's a real possibility of hearing her play. (What's an 'unreal possibility'?).
    Last edited by keannu; 16-Nov-2011 at 05:24. Reason: further question

  5. keannu's Avatar
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    #5

    Re: To hear her play classical piano

    My question is simple! In 2, you can change the first sentence to the second without any doubt, but in 1, can you change it both a and b or only to a depending on the context? I know context is vital, so is it variable?
    1.To hear her play classical piano, you wouldn't believe that she's blind.
    => a)If you heard her play classical piano, you wouldn't believe that she's blind.
    => b)If you hear her play classical piano, you wouldn't believe that she's blind.
    2.To hear her play classical piano, you won't believe that she's blind.
    => If you hear her play classical piano, you won't believe that she's blind.

  6. Raymott's Avatar
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    #6

    Re: To hear her play classical piano

    Quote Originally Posted by keannu View Post
    My question is simple! In 2, you can change the first sentence to the second without any doubt, but in 1, can you change it both a and b or only to a depending on the context? I know context is vital, so is it variable?
    1.To hear her play classical piano, you wouldn't believe that she's blind.
    => a)If you heard her play classical piano, you wouldn't believe that she's blind.
    => b)If you hear her play classical piano, you wouldn't believe that she's blind.
    2.To hear her play classical piano, you won't believe that she's blind.
    => If you hear her play classical piano, you won't believe that she's blind.
    b isn't grammatical. So, you could only express 1. as a.

  7. keannu's Avatar
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    #7

    Re: To hear her play classical piano

    Quote Originally Posted by Raymott View Post
    b isn't grammatical. So, you could only express 1. as a.
    Not only grammatically, but also meaning and perception-wise, do they think and speak so? I'm sorry I'm too persistent.

  8. Raymott's Avatar
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    #8

    Re: To hear her play classical piano

    Quote Originally Posted by keannu View Post
    Not only grammatically, but also meaning and perception-wise, do they think and speak so? I'm sorry I'm too persistent.
    No, people don't say, "If you hear her, you wouldn't believe it."
    It's either: "If you hear, you won't..." or "If you heard her, you wouldn't .."

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