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    #1

    when "and no smaller" is added

    Hi,

    Do you think (1) is OK?

    (1) We expected their house to be very big, but it's no bigger and no smaller than ours.

    Thank you in advance
    Seiichi MYOGA

    I added the "and no smaller" part to the original sentence. It seems to me that with or withour that part, the sentence means the same. Do you think I'm on the right track?



  1. Barb_D's Avatar
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    #2

    Re: when "and no smaller" is added

    No. You are really struggling with this.

    If it's "no bigger than ours" it may be the same size or it may be smaller.
    If it's "no smaller than ours" it may the same size or it may be bigger.
    If you say "it's no bigger and no smaller than ours" it means it is exactly the same size.

    You say "no bigger than" something you see as relatively small.
    You say "no smaller than" something you say as relatively large.
    The point is to set up a contrast of expectations.

    If you think your house is small, and you are surprised to find theirs is small, you say "no larger than ours."
    If you had expected theirs to be very small, then you compare it to your house, which you had thought would be larger relative to theirs: It was no smaller than ours.
    I'm not a teacher, but I write for a living. Please don't ask me about 2nd conditionals, but I'm a safe bet for what reads well in (American) English.

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    #3

    Re: when "and no smaller" is added

    We expected their house to be very big, but it's no bigger and no smaller than ours.

    Did you consider writing


    "We expected their house to be very big, but it's the same size as ours"?


    Rover

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    #4

    Re: when "and no smaller" is added

    Dear Barb_B and Rover,

    I appreciate your help and comments.

    My question was based on this:
    (i) We expected their house to be very big,but it’s no bigger than ours. or… it isn’t any bigger than ours. (= not even a little bigger) (Murphy 2004:212)
    And Master (1995:115) says that "no bigger than" in (ii) means "the same size as," which is also represented formally as "the size of."
    (ii) The central processor is no bigger than a postage stamp.

    So, let me rephrase my question?

    I know (2) is OK.

    (2) Their house is no bigger
    and no smaller than ours. (Sorry, I forgot to add something.)
    (3) We expected their house to be very big, but it's no bigger and no smaller than ours.

    Do you think (3) is also OK?

    Seiichi MYOGA

    Last edited by Seiichi MYOGA; 12-Jul-2012 at 14:23.

  2. Barb_D's Avatar
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    #5

    Re: when "and no smaller" is added

    I don't know how to make this more clear to you.

    No bigger than ours = same size as ours OR smaller than ours.
    No smaller than ours = same size as ours OR larger than ours.
    No bigger and no smaller than ours = same size as ours

    Your #3 is okay if you mean they are exactly the same size. But why not say "but it's the same size as ours"?
    Last edited by Barb_D; 11-Jul-2012 at 18:13.
    I'm not a teacher, but I write for a living. Please don't ask me about 2nd conditionals, but I'm a safe bet for what reads well in (American) English.

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    #6

    Re: when "and no smaller" is added

    I'm struggling to read such small print, but I think Barb has already answered this question.

    Rover

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    #7

    Re: when "and no smaller" is added

    This reminds me me (unhelpfully I know, but it's quite funny) of Walpole's [?] insult about a newly built villa in Chiswick: 'Too small to live in but too big to put on your watch-chain'.

    b

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    #8

    Re: when "and no smaller" is added

    Dear Barb_D and BobK,
    I appreciate your help and comments.

    Can I ask one last question? Your comments made me realize what I should have asked in the first place.

    If I follow you, (4) should be OK.

    (4) We expected their house to be very big, but it's no bigger than ours, and [possibly / probably] smaller.

    Do you agree that (4) works?
    Thank you in advance
    Seiichi MYOGA


    Quote Originally Posted by Rover_KE View Post
    I'm struggling to read such small print, but I think Barb has already answered this question.
    Rover
    Sorry, Rover_KE. There seemed to me to be no problem in font size on my display.

    Last edited by Seiichi MYOGA; 12-Jul-2012 at 02:36.

  4. Barb_D's Avatar
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    #9

    Re: when "and no smaller" is added

    Yes that is okay.
    I'm not a teacher, but I write for a living. Please don't ask me about 2nd conditionals, but I'm a safe bet for what reads well in (American) English.

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    #10

    Re: when "and no smaller" is added

    Dear Barb_D,

    I appreciate your help and comments, as always.

    Seiichi MYOGA

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