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  1. Junior Member
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    #1

    Thumbs down object or object complement

    1. 'I consider him a kind man'

    2. 'I consider him as a kind man'. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * here ''a kind man'' and ''as a kind man'' work as object complement?*

  2. Academic Writing's Avatar
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    #2

    Re: object or object complement

    Hi Babai,

    Number 1 is correct. Number 2 should be "I consider him to be a kind man."
    SeriousScholar.com

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    #3

    Re: object or object complement

    Quote Originally Posted by Babai View Post
    1. 'I consider him a kind man'

    2. 'I consider him as a kind man'. * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * here ''a kind man'' and ''as a kind man'' work as object complement?*
    That is the traditional approach, yes. In transformational grammar, some may think along these lines:

    I consider [him a kind man].

    although "him" looks like an object (dative), still it may be understood as the subject of the bracketed infinitive clause ('to be' is dropped but is there).

    One possible -- possibly not irrefutable - argument in favor of this analysis can be formulated by involving idiom chunks. There are nouns that can serve as subjects only, not objects.

    I consider [the **** to have hit the fan.]

    It is not the **** that forms the focus of my consideration. No.


    Food for thought. Hope it helps.

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    #4

    Re: object or object complement

    Quote Originally Posted by Academic Writing View Post
    Hi Babai,

    Number 1 is correct. Number 2 should be "I consider him to be a kind man."
    'to be' is optional.

  3. emsr2d2's Avatar
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    #5

    Re: object or object complement

    All those stars in your post are entirely unnecessary.
    Remember - if you don't use correct capitalisation, punctuation and spacing, anything you write will be incorrect.

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    #6

    Re: object or object complement

    ***** NOT A TEACHER *****


    Hello, Babai:

    May I add my two bits to the excellent answers already posted?

    a. I consider him a kind man.

    b. I consider him to be a kind man.

    c. ???I consider him as a kind man.

    1. I googled "I consider him as," and the first result was a thread at this website! On July 9. 2010, a member named

    IHIVG said that he thought the following are all correct: I consider him a fool/ to be a fool/ as a fool.

    2. I then clicked on the "books" section and found many examples, which I shall share with you. Then you can decide for

    yourself as to whether "as a kind man" is "correct" English.

    3. I found a book called English Usage for the Cat by Sujit Kumar. He says that "consider" is "generally" NOT followed by "to be" or "as." So I guess that he would accept only "I consider him a kind man."

    He claims that you may use "consider as" only in this kind of sentence:" The professor considered Valpayee first as a poet and second as an administrator." He says that "consider as" in that sentence means to "examine" or "discuss."

    So I guess that he would approve of the following: I am going to talk about Tom. I will consider him first as my brother and second as my best friend.

    4. I shall now quote sections of books. Many of those books are older books.

    a. "I consider him as one of the best generals ...." (The Public Character of Europe) (1816) Francis Gibbon.

    b. "I consider him as a gentleman that hath [has] received ...." (Great Britain Public Records Office) (1862)

    c. "I consider him as my fellow wrongdoer." (Nez Perce Dictionary) (1994)

    d. "Nay [more than that], the poor of his parish are taught to consider him as a monster." (The Gentlemen's Magazine) (1866)

    e. My favorite is from Graham's American Monthly (1813):

    "Do you think him handsome?"

    "Certainly," replied Lucy. "I consider him as one of the handsomest men I know."

    (I think that she must have been referring to me! )

    Sincerely yours,


    James
    Last edited by TheParser; 08-Sep-2012 at 16:49.

  4. Chicken Sandwich's Avatar
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    #7

    Re: object or object complement

    Quote Originally Posted by TheParser View Post
    3. I found a book on Indian English. It is called English Usage for the Cat by Kumar Sujit. He says that "consider" is "generally" NOT followed by "to be" or "as." So I guess that he would accept only "I consider him a kind man."
    NOT A TEACHER

    I have consulted English Usage for the CAT (CAT is an abbreviation for Common Admission Test, it was not written for the furry animal ) on Google Books. I could not find any mention that this book was specifically on Indian English.

    Unfortunately, I could not find what he meant by "generally" because of the limited number of pages that I could access, but contrary to what he says, "consider" can be followed by "to be" according to the Longman Dictionary of Contemporary English:

    consider somebody/something (to be) something

    They consider themselves to be Europeans.
    Last edited by Chicken Sandwich; 08-Sep-2012 at 16:25.

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    #8

    Re: object or object complement

    ***** NOT A TEACHER *****


    Thank you very much for your hard work in checking up on these matters.

    I have deleted any reference to any particular variety of English.

    Furthermore, I noticed that the author is referred to as Sujit Kumar, not Kumar Sujit.

    And thanks for teaching me the meaning of CAT.

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