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    #1

    A handsome man who

    Would you please take a look at these two sentences and correct my mistakes. I am not sure if I have punctuated them correctly.

    John was a handsome man who carried himself with self-confidence which made him attractive to women. Indeed, he could pick almost any women in the town.

  1. MikeNewYork's Avatar
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    #2

    Re: A handsome man who

    I would put a comma before "which".

  2. Piscean's Avatar
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    #3

    Re: A handsome man who

    I would also put a comma before 'who'. In my opinion the 'who' introduces a non-defining relative clause.

  3. MikeNewYork's Avatar
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    #4

    Re: A handsome man who

    Too many commas for me.

  4. Piscean's Avatar
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    #5

    Re: A handsome man who

    You need them if it's meant to be a non-defining clause.

  5. MikeNewYork's Avatar
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    #6

    Re: A handsome man who

    I could read the first as a defining clause. Besides, comma "rules" are not set in stone. When they screw up a sentence, they can be omitted.

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    #7

    Re: A handsome man who

    I have tried for years to learn to correctly punctuate non-defining and defining clauses, and still I make mistakes. And although I know the rules, and I have posted many sentences on this forum with such sentences, I am still not sure when I write those sentences. I am wondering if native speakers have problems in recognizing the difference between non-defining and defining clauses. I think that for non-native speakers of English, this is the one of the main difficulties regarding English grammar.

  6. MikeNewYork's Avatar
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    #8

    Re: A handsome man who

    Even native speakers can disagree.

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    #9

    Re: A handsome man who

    To me, the meaning is clear without any commas, but I would change 'any women' to 'any woman'.

  7. Piscean's Avatar
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    #10

    Re: A handsome man who

    Quote Originally Posted by MikeNewYork View Post
    Even native speakers can disagree.
    True, but if the writer intended the clause to be non-defining, then most grammarians and writers of style guides would say that the comma I suggested was essential.

    comma "rules" are not set in stone.
    Actually, the use of commas in defining and non-defining clauses is one of the few areas of punctuation on which most authorities do agree.

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