Page 1 of 2 1 2 Last
Results 1 to 10 of 15
  1. Key Member
    Student or Learner
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • Turkish
      • Home Country:
      • Turkey
      • Current Location:
      • Turkey

    • Join Date: Jun 2016
    • Posts: 2,073
    #1

    certify or certify that

    Certify:formal to say in a formal or official way that something is true or correct. [+that].

    I would like to ask what it means by [+that] ?

    Which one is correct?

    1. I certify that the information I have given is true. [original]
    2. I certify the information I have given is true. [offer]

    Source: Cambridge Learner's Dictionary.

    Thank you.

  2. Charlie Bernstein's Avatar
    Key Member
    Other
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • United States
      • Current Location:
      • United States

    • Join Date: Jan 2009
    • Posts: 4,597
    #2

    Re: certify or certify that

    Quote Originally Posted by hhtt21 View Post
    Certify:formal to say in a formal or official way that something is true or correct. [+that].

    I would like to ask what is meant by [+that](no space, no question mark).

    Which one is correct?

    1. I certify that the information I have given is true. [original]
    2. I certify the information I have given is true. [offer]

    Source: Cambridge Learner's Dictionary.

    Thank you.
    In American English both are fine and natural and mean the same thing. The second is more informal.

    The that tells the listener what is being certified. Without that, the literal meaning is that you're certifying the information itself: I certify the information. And that doesn't really make sense, because you can't certify information. So leaving that out isn't accurate. But since the meaning is still clear without ​that, it's fine to save breath by skipping it.
    I'm not a teacher. I speak American English. I've tutored writing at the University of Southern Maine and have done a good deal of copy editing and writing, occasionally for publication.

  3. Key Member
    Student or Learner
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • Turkish
      • Home Country:
      • Turkey
      • Current Location:
      • Turkey

    • Join Date: Jun 2016
    • Posts: 2,073
    #3

    Re: certify or certify that

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie Bernstein View Post
    In American English both are fine and natural and mean the same thing. The second is more informal.

    The that tells the listener what is being certified. Without that, the literal meaning is that you're certifying the information itself: I certify the information. And that doesn't really make sense, because you can't certify information. So leaving that out isn't accurate. But since the meaning is still clear without ​that, it's fine to save breath by skipping it.
    This is really confusing because at first you claim both are fine in AE, but then you the second one is incorrect or at least seems incorrect. (You used accurate)

    Thank you.

  4. Charlie Bernstein's Avatar
    Key Member
    Other
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • United States
      • Current Location:
      • United States

    • Join Date: Jan 2009
    • Posts: 4,597
    #4

    Re: certify or certify that

    Quote Originally Posted by hhtt21 View Post
    This is really confusing because at first you claim both are fine in AE, but then you the second one is incorrect or at least seems incorrect. (You used accurate)

    Thank you.
    Good question. Words don't have to be accurate to be understood. In sentences like these, leaving out that is common shorthand (that) everyone understands.
    I'm not a teacher. I speak American English. I've tutored writing at the University of Southern Maine and have done a good deal of copy editing and writing, occasionally for publication.

  5. Key Member
    Student or Learner
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • Turkish
      • Home Country:
      • Turkey
      • Current Location:
      • Turkey

    • Join Date: Jun 2016
    • Posts: 2,073
    #5

    Re: certify or certify that

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie Bernstein View Post
    Good question. Words don't have to be accurate to be understood. In sentences like these, leaving out that is common shorthand (that) everyone understands.
    Does accurate in the above mean "correct" ?

    Thank you.

  6. Phaedrus's Avatar
    Senior Member
    English Teacher
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • United States
      • Current Location:
      • United States

    • Join Date: Jul 2012
    • Posts: 651
    #6

    Re: certify or certify that

    1. I certify that the information I have given is true.
    2. I certify the information I have given is true.
    To add to what Charlie Bernstein has said, many verbs, including "certify," can be complemented by "that"-clauses or noun phrases. (Other verbs in that category: "say," "think," "find," etc.) When complemented by "that"-clauses, such verbs need not actually be followed by "that," which is omissible in that context. However, "that" helps to clarify that a verb is being complemented by a "that" clause. And that is important when there is a risk of ambiguity. For example:

    (a) He found the ball that he played with when he was growing up was damaged.
    (b) He found that the ball that he played with when he was growing up was damaged.

    Both (a) and (b) are correct, but sentence (b) is better than (a), because (a) will mislead readers. In (a), it is not until one reaches "was" that one realizes that "found" is being complemented by a "that"-clause (with an omitted "that") rather than by a noun phrase. But with shorter sentences, there is no such risk:

    (c) He found it was damaged.
    (d) He found that it was damaged.

    Neither of those sentences is better than the other. No one will be misled by the omitted "that" in (c).

  7. Key Member
    Student or Learner
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • Turkish
      • Home Country:
      • Turkey
      • Current Location:
      • Turkey

    • Join Date: Jun 2016
    • Posts: 2,073
    #7

    Re: certify or certify that

    Quote Originally Posted by Phaedrus View Post
    For example:

    (a) He found the ball that he played with when he was growing up was damaged.
    (b) He found that the ball that he played with when he was growing up was damaged.

    Both (a) and (b) are correct, but sentence (b) is better than (a), because (a) will mislead readers. In (a), it is not until one reaches "was" that one realizes that "found" is being complemented by a "that"-clause (with an omitted "that") rather than by a noun phrase. But with shorter sentences, there is no such risk:
    Does this "found" mean "learn" or "encounter" ?

    For example:
    1. "after meeting his childhood friend, he found that the ball that he played with when he was growing up was damaged"
    2. "When he came to parent's house for years later, he found that the ball that he played with when he was growing up was damage"

    Thank you.

  8. emsr2d2's Avatar
    Moderator
    English Teacher
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • British English
      • Home Country:
      • UK
      • Current Location:
      • UK

    • Join Date: Jul 2009
    • Posts: 47,916
    #8

    Re: certify or certify that

    It means "discovered" in that context.
    Remember - if you don't use correct capitalisation, punctuation and spacing, anything you write will be incorrect.

  9. Key Member
    Student or Learner
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • Turkish
      • Home Country:
      • Turkey
      • Current Location:
      • Turkey

    • Join Date: Jun 2016
    • Posts: 2,073
    #9

    Re: certify or certify that

    Quote Originally Posted by Phaedrus View Post
    To add to what Charlie Bernstein has said, many verbs, including "certify," can be complemented by "that"-clauses or noun phrases. (Other verbs in that category: "say," "think," "find," etc.) When complemented by "that"-clauses, such verbs need not actually be followed by "that," which is omissible in that context. However, "that" helps to clarify that a verb is being complemented by a "that" clause. And that is important when there is a risk of ambiguity. For example:

    (a) He found the ball that he played with when he was growing up was damaged.
    (b) He found that the ball that he played with when he was growing up was damaged.

    Both (a) and (b) are correct, but sentence (b) is better than (a), because (a) will mislead readers. In (a), it is not until one reaches "was" that one realizes that "found" is being complemented by a "that"-clause (with an omitted "that") rather than by a noun phrase. But with shorter sentences, there is no such risk
    Would you please explain how can it be otherwise i.e how cannot it be complemented by "that-clause" in those sentence, a and b ?

    Thank you.

  10. Phaedrus's Avatar
    Senior Member
    English Teacher
    • Member Info
      • Native Language:
      • English
      • Home Country:
      • United States
      • Current Location:
      • United States

    • Join Date: Jul 2012
    • Posts: 651
    #10

    Re: certify or certify that

    Would you please explain how can it be otherwise i.e how cannot it be complemented by "that-clause" in those sentence, a and b ?
    Neither can be interpreted otherwise. But in (a) it's not clear that you're seeing a "that"-clause complement without "that" (as opposed to the structure "He found it") until you reach the verb phrase "was damaged," whereas in (b) the reader learns right from the get-go that he is dealing with a "that"-clause and not with the following, which does have the structure "He found it":

    (e) He found the ball that he played with when he was growing up.

Page 1 of 2 1 2 Last

Similar Threads

  1. It is to certify
    By Untaught88 in forum Ask a Teacher
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 17-Jan-2017, 07:24

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •