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  1. #1
    glhf is offline Newbie
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    Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food

    Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food end up trying it but not eating it on a regular basis.

    Shouldn't this sentence be 'Children that their parents forbit them to eat fast food end up...'?

    Thank you in advance!

    Source: English textbook

  2. #2
    Charlie Bernstein's Avatar
    Charlie Bernstein is offline VIP Member
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    Re: Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food

    Quote Originally Posted by glhf View Post
    Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food end up trying it but not eating it on a regular basis.

    Shouldn't this sentence be 'Children that their parents forbid them to eat fast food end up...'?

    No. It's a complicated sentence, but it's correct. Diagram it and you'll see. Your version is wrong.


    Thank you! You're obviously thanking us in advance, since we can't answer your question before you ask it. So don't say "in advance."

    It's a common error. You can say:


    - Thank you!
    - Thanks!
    - Many thanks!
    - Thanks so much!


    Source: English textbook
    You're welcome.
    I'm not a teacher. I speak American English. I've tutored writing at the University of Southern Maine and have done a good deal of copy editing and writing, occasionally for publication.

  3. #3
    glhf is offline Newbie
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    Re: Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food

    Children that their parents forbid them to eat fast food end up trying it but not eating it on a regular basis.

    Is this completely wrong? Then why? Cause it feels more natural and apprehensible to me.

    Thank you.

  4. #4
    Charlie Bernstein's Avatar
    Charlie Bernstein is offline VIP Member
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    Re: Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food

    Quote Originally Posted by glhf View Post
    Children that their parents forbid them to eat fast food end up trying it but not eating it on a regular basis.

    Is this completely wrong? Then why? Because it feels more natural and comprehensible to me.

    Thank you.
    Yes, it's wrong. Again, try diagramming. You could say "Children whose parents forbid . . . ." or "Children who have parents who forbid . . . ."

    1. The pronoun that is for things, not people:

    - Wrong: She wanted a man that could cook.
    - Right: She wanted a man who could cook.

    - Wrong: He has a car who gets great mileage.
    - Right: He has a car that gets great mileage.

    2. Somehow, you need a possessive word connecting the children to the parents. I've given you three examples of how you might do that.

    Again, it's a difficult sentence. Remember that what's natural in Korean might not be natural in English.

    I hope this has helped a little.
    I'm not a teacher. I speak American English. I've tutored writing at the University of Southern Maine and have done a good deal of copy editing and writing, occasionally for publication.

  5. #5
    Rover_KE is offline Moderator
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    Re: Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food

    Quote Originally Posted by glhf View Post
    Children that their parents forbid them to eat fast food end up trying it but not eating it on a regular basis.

    Is this completely wrong? Yes.

    Then why? It's ungrammatical. You could start 'Children whose parents ...'

    Because It feels more natural and apprehensible comprehensible to me.

    Thank you.
    You don't need to thank me in advance. Just click 'Thank' after you have received a useful answer.

    I notice that your source is your 'English Textbook'. Please tell us the title and author, and also the grammar points that the quoted sentence is making or illustrating.

    (EDIT: Cross-posted)

  6. #6
    glhf is offline Newbie
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    Re: Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food

    It is just an example sentence from my writing TOEFL textbook. The author is David Cho. (The title is Hackers TOEFL Writing)

  7. #7
    glhf is offline Newbie
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    Re: Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie Bernstein View Post
    1. The pronoun that is for things, not people:

    - Wrong: She wanted a man that could cook.
    - Right: She wanted a man who could cook.

    - Wrong: He has a car who gets great mileage.
    - Right: He has a car that gets great mileage.
    I found this on the Internet. (Link)

    Do you find it difficult to know when to use “who” vs. “that”? These two words are relative pronouns that tie together groups of words to nouns or other pronouns.Let’s take this sentence: “The runner who exercises regularly usually does the best.”
    “Who” connects the subject, runner, to the verb “exercises.”
    Many people will say “The runner that exercises usually does the best.”
    Here’s the thing: “who” (and its forms) refers to people. “That” usually refers to things, but it can refer to people in a general sense (like a class or type of person: see “runner.”). Purdue Online Writing Lab says, “When referring to people, both that and who can be used in informal language. ‘That’ may be used to refer to the characteristics or abilities of an individual or a group of people.… However, when speaking about a particular person in for*mal language, who is preferred.”
    That said, many people and some respected references prefer “people that,” and it’s not wrong. Think Chaucer. Shakespeare. Dickens.

    And this

    "Who" refers to people; "that" may refer to either people or things. Use "who" if doing so would help your reader identity the antecedent. That's not a problem with your text.
    "... the only way to do this was by taking control ...."

    from here

    Also see here
    Last edited by glhf; 25-Oct-2017 at 14:58.

  8. #8
    Roman55's Avatar
    Roman55 is offline Key Member
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    Re: Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie Bernstein View Post
    1. The pronoun that is for things, not people:

    - Wrong: She wanted a man that could cook.
    - Right: She wanted a man who could cook.
    I beg to differ. That has been used to refer to people for about a thousand years, and is perfectly acceptable in modern BrE. Who, on the other hand, can only be used with people and not things.
    I am not a teacher

  9. #9
    tzfujimino's Avatar
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    Re: Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food

    Quote Originally Posted by glhf View Post
    Children that their parents forbid them to eat fast food end up trying it but not eating it on a regular basis.
    If you delete "them" from the sentence above, it looks grammatical to me:

    Children that/whom their parents forbid to eat fast food ...

    I'm not sure if it's natural, though.

  10. #10
    Tarheel's Avatar
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    Re: Children of parents who forbid them to eat fast food

    Perhaps:

    Children whose parents forbid them to eat fast food end up trying it but not eating it on a regular basis.

    "On a regular basis" can mean any of several things. It can mean daily. It can mean once or twice a week. It can mean once or twice a month. Perhaps "but eating it only occasionally" would work better.

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