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Thread: Ful or fl

  1. #1
    Rachel Adams is offline Key Member
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    Ful or fl

    Hello.

    When you pronounce the ending ''ful'' in ''beautiful'' do you pronounce it as ''ful'' in spoken English or as ''fl''? Because I hear it as ''ful.''

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    GoesStation is offline Moderator
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    Re: Ful or fl

    The ending /fl/ can't be pronounced in English. It needs a vowel. The vowel in the suffix -ful is a schwa.
    I am not a teacher.

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    Charlie Bernstein's Avatar
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    Re: Ful or fl

    Yes, it's a schwa. There might be regional differences in pronunciation. I do pronounce it fl — like waffle.
    I'm not a teacher. I speak American English. I've tutored writing at the University of Southern Maine and have done a good deal of copy editing and writing, occasionally for publication.

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    Rachel Adams is offline Key Member
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    Re: Ful or fl

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie Bernstein View Post
    Yes, it's a schwa. There might be regional differences in pronunciation. I do pronounce it fl — like waffle.
    Yes, that's what I was interested in. If native speakers ever say "ful" in "beautiful"?

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    Re: Ful or fl

    Quote Originally Posted by Rachel Adams View Post
    Yes, that's what I was interested in. If native speakers ever say "ful" in "beautiful"?
    I pronounce the last syllable exactly like the word full and stress the first syllable.
    Not a professional teacher

  6. #6
    Rachel Adams is offline Key Member
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    Re: Ful or fl

    Quote Originally Posted by Piscean View Post
    Some will pronounce the -ful with the full /ʊ/, some with a schwa, and some with a syllabic vowel.
    So it can be pronounced as /fl/, /ful/, and with a schwa, but how do you transcribe and pronounce it when it is pronounced with a schwa and which pronunciation is standard?
    Ful as /fl/ as a syllabic /l/
    Ful as /u/
    Ful with a schwa /?/

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    GoesStation is offline Moderator
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    Re: Ful or fl

    People who aren't familiar with phonetic transcription won't know how to pronounce "/fl/". Did you notice the IPA symbol in Piscean's transcription, "/fl̩/"?
    I am not a teacher.

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    Rachel Adams is offline Key Member
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    Re: Ful or fl

    Quote Originally Posted by GoesStation View Post
    People who aren't familiar with phonetic transcription won't know how to pronounce "/fl/". Did you notice the IPA symbol in Piscean's transcription, "/fl̩/"?
    Yes, it would be very helpful to read about those signs. I often see commas in different places in phonetic transcription. But how would a native ranscribe and pronounce it with a schwa?

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    GoesStation is offline Moderator
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    Re: Ful or fl

    Quote Originally Posted by Rachel Adams View Post
    Yes, it would be very helpful to read about those signs. I often see commas in different places in phonetic transcription. But how would a native ranscribe and pronounce it with a schwa?
    I'd write BYOO-tih-full as an approximate transcription. That's a good example of why the IPA exists, though: it could be read a number of ways.

    I don't think the descending line in /fl̩/ is a comma. It's just a symbol indicating that the L is syllabic.
    I am not a teacher.

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    Re: Ful or fl

    Quote Originally Posted by Rachel Adams View Post
    So it can be pronounced as /fl/, /ful/, and with a schwa, but how do you transcribe and pronounce it when it is pronounced with a schwa and which pronunciation is standard?
    Ful as /fl/ as a syllabic /l/
    Ful as /u/
    Ful with a schwa /?/
    As you can see, you have some choices. All the pronunciations we've mentioned are standard (and very close to each other).
    I'm not a teacher. I speak American English. I've tutored writing at the University of Southern Maine and have done a good deal of copy editing and writing, occasionally for publication.

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