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    #1

    Wink Zero article

    In order to have a clearer concept in the use of the definte article, could you please tell me why the zero article is used before "British politics instead of "the" British politics", and "the radical resturcturing" instead of "Radical restructuring" in the following sentence?

    The radical restructuring of (zero article)British politics after 1931 lies not in the events of 13th-28th August but in the changing attitudes within the National Government during September and October 1931.


    Is it because "British politics" is generalising and unspecified while radical restructuring is specified (but by what expressions in the sentence?)

    Thanks again.

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    #2

    Re: Zero article

    The adjective British is not sufficient to specify politics It remains general= no article.
    this is not any restructuring , this is the restructuring of +after 1931.

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    #3

    Re: Zero article

    Quote Originally Posted by CHOMAT View Post
    The adjective British is not sufficient to specify politics It remains general= no article.
    this is not any restructuring , this is the restructuring of +after 1931.
    Thank you, Chomat. But could you elaborate further why "British" is not sufficent to specify politics? To my understanding, it is the "British" but not other countries that the politics is concerned. Thanks.

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    #4

    Re: Zero article

    That's quite relevant !
    The topic of the text leads the reader to understand that it is dealing with British Politics as a whole as a notion studied in a definite point of its history. The context might imply that the topic will remain in GB . There are neither reference norcomparisonto other countries politically speaking. I let you meditate upon the following example :
    The oil industry is more competitive than the clothing industry

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    #5

    Re: Zero article

    Quote Originally Posted by CHOMAT View Post
    That's quite relevant !
    The topic of the text leads the reader to understand that it is dealing with British Politics as a whole as a notion studied in a definite point of its history. The context might imply that the topic will remain in GB . There are neither reference norcomparisonto other countries politically speaking. I let you meditate upon the following example :
    The oil industry is more competitive than the clothing industry
    I am digesting what you have said. Thanks again.

  1. #6

    Re: Zero article

    Quote Originally Posted by albertino View Post
    Thank you, Chomat. But could you elaborate further why "British" is not sufficent to specify politics? To my understanding, it is the "British" but not other countries that the politics is concerned. Thanks.
    Hi, sorry to butt in!
    Three things come to mind:
    a) Albertino, you are right in the sense that "British" does make "politics" definite , so in the same way a possessive pronoun makes a noun (her car) definite and therefore not require an article, "British politics" is sufficient. I believe CHOMAT was trying to say that "British" doesn't define ALL politics (worldwide).
    b) CHOMAT is right too in that "British politics" in general is being referred to, not specific political parties or agendas.
    c) Another point is that nouns are usually made definite by following "of-phrases" or adjective clauses/phrases (although remember that the mere presence of these does not necessarily make a noun definite) not simply by preceding adjectives.


    CHOMAT's examples (the oil industry etc...) are a bit misleading because they are set phrases. Even if some of these "rules" seem at odds with each other, they all play a role in why a native speaker would choose or not choose to use a definite article.

    Hope that helps
    Fiona

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    #7

    Unhappy Re: Zero article

    Quote Originally Posted by fiona bramble View Post
    Hi, sorry to butt in!
    Three things come to mind:
    a) Albertino, you are right in the sense that "British" does make "politics" definite , so in the same way a possessive pronoun makes a noun (her car) definite and therefore not require an article, "British politics" is sufficient. I believe CHOMAT was trying to say that "British" doesn't define ALL politics (worldwide).
    b) CHOMAT is right too in that "British politics" in general is being referred to, not specific political parties or agendas.
    c) Another point is that nouns are usually made definite by following "of-phrases" or adjective clauses/phrases (although remember that the mere presence of these does not necessarily make a noun definite) not simply by preceding adjectives.


    CHOMAT's examples (the oil industry etc...) are a bit misleading because they are set phrases. Even if some of these "rules" seem at odds with each other, they all play a role in why a native speaker would choose or not choose to use a definite article.

    Hope that helps
    Fiona
    Fiona, thanks for your advice
    The sticky points as to the use of the definite article are just what you have said in item (c) of your response that make me mad.

  2. #8

    Re: Zero article

    Quote Originally Posted by albertino View Post
    Fiona, thanks for your advice
    The sticky points as to the use of the definite article are just what you have said in item (c) of your response that make me mad.
    Yikes! Mad at me? I'm not sure I understand
    F

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    #9

    Re: Zero article

    Neither do I . I have an itch for.... the c explanation. A good explanation.

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    #10

    Wink Re: Zero article

    Quote Originally Posted by fiona bramble View Post
    Yikes! Mad at me? I'm not sure I understand
    F
    Fiona,
    My regrets for the misunderstandiang. I am not mad at you but the grammar difficulties. As you have said, "That nouns are usually made definite by following "of-phrases (many grammar books tell us so), but sometimes it does not apply in certain scenarios when "the mere presence of "of-phrases" does not necessarily make a noun definite". In this respect (the underlined), Fiona, could you give me some examples and tell me when the definite article should be used and when it should not? Indeed, these uncertainties have confused me so much in writing and I think many Asian English learners have the same problem as me.

    Thanks for helping!

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