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  1. Unregistered
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    #1

    me/I

    Is it more correct to say:

    you will be meeting Mary, John and me

    or

    You will be meeting Mary, John and I

    thanks!

  2. Soup's Avatar
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    #2

    Re: me/I

    Mary, John ... function as the verb's object, and object pronouns look like this, me, he, she, them; so,


    [1] You will be meeting they and I. <object>
    [2] You will be meeting them and me. <object>

    Speakers, however, will and do indeed use ... meeting Mary, John and I because using "I" sounds more formal to them.


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    #3

    Re: me/I

    Quote Originally Posted by Soup View Post
    Mary, John ... function as the verb's object, and object pronouns look like this, me, he, she, them; so,


    [1] You will be meeting they and I. <object>
    [2] You will be meeting them and me. <object>

    Speakers, however, will and do indeed use ... meeting Mary, John and I because using "I" sounds more formal to them.
    Good points, Soup.

    With speakers using them in this fashion, it points to an evolving pronoun system. Actually, it has been changing/evolving for centuries, has it not?

    And isn't that precisely what language is all about, using grammatical forms in differing ways in order to effect different nuances/meanings.

  3. Barb_D's Avatar
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    #4

    Re: me/I

    Regardless, if the person is taking an exam, which no doubt wants to see formal grammar, then "me" is the correct choice.


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    #5

    Re: me/I

    Quote Originally Posted by Barb_D View Post
    Regardless, if the person is taking an exam, which no doubt wants to see formal grammar, then "me" is the correct choice.
    It's really not possible to determine whether that's the case, Barb. Note that in the initial query, the person used 'say'.

    Is it more correct to say:

    The fall-back position to the "exam" issue is more than a bit nonsensical. Just because some teacher makes the decision that something is "wrong" clearly doesn't make it wrong.

    Do you go around warning students that they ought to answer that the earth is flat because they may have a teacher who is a dinosaur?

    The CGEL says this particular collocation is "so common in speech and used by so broad a range of speakers that it has to be recognized as a variety of Standard English, ...".

    Why don't you have a problem with 'you' used for both singular and plural? If we want to be correct surely we must return to the pronouns used in older forms of English.


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    #6

    Re: me/I

    The guest to this forum asked:
    Is it more correct to say:

    You will be meeting Mary, John and me


    The answer, therefore, with regard to Standard English, is yes.
    Standard English remains the yardstick, not a "variety".


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    #7

    Re: me/I

    Quote Originally Posted by David L. View Post
    The guest to this forum asked:
    Is it more correct to say:

    You will be meeting Mary, John and me


    The answer, therefore, with regard to Standard English, is yes.
    Standard English remains the yardstick, not a "variety".
    I agree with you, David. Let's do away with BrE.

  4. Soup's Avatar
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    #8

    Re: me/I

    Quote Originally Posted by riverkid View Post
    Good points, Soup. With speakers using them in this fashion, it points to an evolving pronoun system. Actually, it has been changing/evolving for centuries, has it not? And isn't that precisely what language is all about, using grammatical forms in differing ways in order to effect different nuances/meanings.
    Well, thank you. By the way, I'm not quite sure what your question is exactly. You may want to consider rewording your post so that your intended meaning is clearer, as that just might address the poster's question.


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    #9

    Re: me/I

    Quote Originally Posted by Soup View Post
    Well, thank you. By the way, I'm not quite sure what your question is exactly. You may want to consider rewording your post so that your intended meaning is clearer, as that just might address the poster's question.
    They seem amply clear to me, Soup.

    The poster's question has been addressed, but let me just recapitulate to help clear up a few things.

    Soup wrote:
    [1] You will be meeting they and I.
    [2] You will be meeting them and me.

    Speakers, however, will and do indeed use ... meeting Mary, John and I because using "I" sounds more formal to them.
    It seems to me, correct me if I'm wrong, that you have unnecessarily mixed up unidiomatic collocations to create a unfair picture of what is actually a very common idiomatic collocation.

    The CGEL says this particular collocation is "so common in speech and used by so broad a range of speakers that it has to be recognized as a variety of Standard English, ...".


    Soup wrote: Mary, John ... function as the verb's object, and object pronouns look like this, me, he, she, them; so,


    Turning to the Democrats, Safire gets on Bill Clinton's case, as he puts it, for asking voters to "give Al Gore and I a chance to bring America back." No one would say [give I a break], because the indirect object of [give] must have objective case. So it should be [give Al Gore and me a chance.]

    Probably no "grammatical error" has received as much scorn as "misuse" of pronoun case inside conjunctions (phrases with two parts joined by [and] or [or]). What teenager has not been corrected for saying [Me and Jennifer are going to the mall]? The standard story is that the object pronoun [me] does not belong in subject position -- no one would say [Me is going to the mall] -- so it should be [Jennifer and I]. People tend to misremember the advice as "When in doubt, say 'so-and-so and I', not 'so-and-so and me'," so they unthinkingly overapply it, resulting in hyper-corrected solecisms like [give Al Gore and I a chance] and the even more despised [between you and I].

    But if the person on the street is so good at avoiding [Me is going] and [Give I a break], and even former Rhodes Scholars and Ivy League professors can't seem to avoid [Me and Jennifer are going] and [Give Al and I a chance], might it not be the mavens that misunderstand English grammar, not the speakers?

    The mavens' case about case rests on one assumption: if an entire conjunction phrase has a grammatical feature like subject case, every word inside that phrase has to have that grammatical feature, too. But that is just false.


    [Jennifer] is singular; you say [Jennifer is], not [Jennifer are]. The pronoun [She] is singular; you say [She is], not [She are]. But the conjunction [She and Jennifer] is not singular, it's plural; you say [She and Jennifer are], not [She and Jennifer is.]

    So a conjunction can have a different grammatical number from the pronouns inside it. Why, then, must it have the same grammatical [case] as the pronouns inside it? The answer is that it need not.

    A conjunction is just not grammatically equivalent to any of its parts. If John and Marsha met, it does not mean that John met and that Marsha met. If voters give Clinton and Gore a chance, they are not giving Gore his own chance, added on to the chance they are giving Clinton; they are giving the entire ticket a chance. So just because [Al Gore and I] is an object that requires object case, it does not mean that [I] is an object that requires object case. By the logic of grammar, the pronoun is free to have any case it wants.

    From "Grammar Puss" by Steven Pinker

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    #10

    Re: me/I

    Quote Originally Posted by riverkid View Post
    I agree with you, David. Let's do away with BrE.
    Do away with British English! How dare you sir! I challenge you to a duel at dawn tomorrow, I will send my second to you this very evening. May God have mercy on your soul.

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