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Taka

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My dictionary says:

You should be careful in crossing the street.=You should be careful when/while you cross the street.

Yeh, probably. But isn't it possible to take such "in" as "concerning" or "with regard to", as in, say, "a country rich in minerals" or "She was not lacking in courage"?
 

Tdol

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Is it an American dictionary? I wouldn't use 'in' there. I'd just say 'careful crossing'.;-)
 

Taka

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tdol said:
Is it an American dictionary? I wouldn't use 'in' there. I'd just say 'careful crossing'.;-)

Actually, it's an English-Japanese dictionary (again). And I've found similar entries in other English-Japanese dictionaries as well. Seems like I really need to throw them away. :lol:

But what about this one. It's from an article written by an American:

As is true throughout the world, the farther out from any urban center, generally the lower the rent will be. However, transportation may be so overcrowded and expensive that one has to balance these two factors in deciding where to settle.

It should be equal to "when one decide". But isn't it possible to take such "in" as "in regard to"?
 

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You could change 'in' to 'when' there without changing the meaning. 'In regard to' would work better, imo, if it came before the factors. ;-)
 

Casiopea

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Taka said:
My dictionary says:

You should be careful in crossing the street.=You should be careful when/while you cross the street.

Yeh, probably. But isn't it possible to take such "in" as "concerning" or "with regard to", as in, say, "a country rich in minerals" or "She was not lacking in courage"?

As with most problems we run across in English-Japanese~Japanese-English dictionaries, the author is, again, using a semantic extension:

You should be careful in these matters/this matter of concern.

You should be careful in (V-ing) who you deal with.
You should be careful in (V-ing) what you expect.
You should be careful in crossing the street. (OK, but sematically awkward for some speakers if they feel 'crossing the street' isn't necessarily considered a matter of/for great concern.

All the best,
 

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tdol said:
You could change 'in' to 'when' there without changing the meaning. 'In regard to' would work better, imo, if it came before the factors. ;-)

Are you saying that if it were " However, transportation may be so overcrowded and expensive that,in deciding where to settle, one has to balance these two factors.", then it should be semantically the same as "....,in regard to deciding where to settle, one has to balance these two factors."?

Why would such difference in your interpretation happen according to the position of the "in"-phrase?
 

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Casiopea said:
You should be careful in these matters/this matter of concern.

You should be careful in (V-ing) who you deal with.
You should be careful in (V-ing) what you expect.
You should be careful in crossing the street. (OK, but sematically awkward for some speakers if they feel 'crossing the street' isn't necessarily

considered a matter of/for great concern.

Sorry Casiopea, but I don't really understand what you' re saying, I'm afraid.

Could you please elaborate?
 

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Taka said:
Casiopea said:
You should be careful in these matters/this matter of concern.

You should be careful in (V-ing) who you deal with.
You should be careful in (V-ing) what you expect.
You should be careful in crossing the street. (OK, but sematically awkward for some speakers if they feel 'crossing the street' isn't necessarily

considered a matter of/for great concern.

Sorry Casiopea, but I don't really understand what you' re saying, I'm afraid.

Could you please elaborate?

As synonyms,

You should be careful when crossing the street. (OK)
You should be careful in crossing the street. (OK)

:D
 

Taka

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Casiopea said:
As synonyms,

You should be careful when crossing the street. (OK)
You should be careful in crossing the street. (OK)

I see. But my question is, isn't it possible to interpret such "in" as "in regard to"?

What do you think?
 

Tdol

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Taka said:
tdol said:
You could change 'in' to 'when' there without changing the meaning. 'In regard to' would work better, imo, if it came before the factors. ;-)

Are you saying that if it were " However, transportation may be so overcrowded and expensive that,in deciding where to settle, one has to balance these two factors.", then it should be semantically the same as "....,in regard to deciding where to settle, one has to balance these two factors."?

Why would such difference in your interpretation happen according to the position of the "in"-phrase?

I'm not very keen on using 'in regard to' here, but could put it at the start as an introductory phrase. I would use the phrase as an introductoru marker rather than for a conclusion.;-)
 

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Taka said:
Casiopea said:
As synonyms,

You should be careful when crossing the street. (OK)
You should be careful in crossing the street. (OK)

I see. But my question is, isn't it possible to interpret such "in" as "in regard to"?

What do you think?

If you mean, in regards to as a synonym for about, then I'd say you've got a case. It's a far reach, though. 8)

1. You should be careful in (the following matter:)crossing the street.

2. You should be careful in regards to (i.e. about) crossing the street.

I also agree with tdol's suggestion. 8)
 

Taka

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tdol said:
I'm not very keen on using 'in regard to' here, but could put it at the start as an introductory phrase. I would use the phrase as an introductoru marker rather than for a conclusion.;-)

Thank you, tdol. But I'm not asking about your preference. My question is, why is it that when it is used as an introductory phrase, it could be "in regard to", whereas when put in the end of the sentence, then "when"?
 

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Casiopea said:
If you mean, in regards to as a synonym for about, then I'd say you've got a case. It's a far reach, though.

1. You should be careful in (the following matter:)crossing the street.

2. You should be careful in regards to (i.e. about) crossing the street.

OK. Then, next question.

Why do you think semantically "in" can be either "when" or "in regard to/about" in the same sentence? IMO, they are different from each other.
 

Casiopea

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Taka said:
OK. Then, next question.

Why do you think semantically "in" can be either "when" or "in regard to/about" in the same sentence? IMO, they are different from each other.

First of all, that's your argument, not mine. :D Second of all, in is synonymous with respect to (Please consult an English dictionary--as you well know, English-Japanese dictionaries are not all that reliable--), which is synonymous with in regards to:

1. in ~ with respect to | with respect to ~ in regard to
2. in ~ in regards to (Semantic Extension)

3. in regards to ~ about
4. in ~ about (Semantic extention)

Semantic extension has already been mentioned, ne?
 

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Casiopea said:
Second of all, in is synonymous with respect to

I know that, Casiopea.

OK, let me tell you what I'm wondering. For example, "It is important when..." and "It is important with respect to..." are not really the same, right? But according to the grammatical rule, you can say "It is important in..." instead for both sentences.

If "in" could mean either "with respect to" or "when", how do you tell the difference in a sentence where the distinction is not so clear? Or, is it that for you native speakers there is not much semantical difference between "when" and "with respect to/about", and that's why you use the same "in" for both?
 

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Pre\post-modifiers? ;-)
 

Taka

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tdol said:
Pre\post-modifiers? ;-)

OK, my understanding is , you said:

in deciding where to settle, one has to balance these two factors. =in regard to/with respect to deciding where to settle, one has to balance these two factors.

whereas;

one has to balance these two factors in deciding where to settle.=one has to balance these two factors when he/she decides where to settle.

Why? they are the same phrase "in deciding where to settle"??
 

Tdol

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I was suggesting that if you wanted to use 'regard', it would fit better at the beginning of the sentence rather than in the middle, where it is rather cumbersome.
 

Taka

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tdol said:
I was suggesting that if you wanted to use 'regard', it would fit better at the beginning of the sentence rather than in the middle, where it is rather cumbersome.

OK. I understand.

Now, could you please give me your comments on this one? (This question is originally given to Casiopea).

Taka said:
Casiopea said:
Second of all, in is synonymous with respect to

OK, let me tell you what I'm wondering. For example, "It is important when..." and "It is important with respect to..." are not really the same, right? But according to the grammatical rule, you can say "It is important in..." instead for both sentences.

If "in" could mean either "with respect to" or "when", how do you tell the difference in a sentence where the distinction is not so clear? Or, is it that for you native speakers there is not much semantical difference between "when" and "with respect to/about", and that's why you use the same "in" for both?
 
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