"like" to mean "as if"

[kfredson]

I don't know what attitudinal past is... I always thought we used the past subjunctive to refer to hypothetical situations/actions. And I think "as if" introduces something hypothetical. I don't think it has anything to do with politeness.

I was simply taught to use it this way, never saw it used otherwise, and thought it was logical. So it isn't?

I have never understood "as if" to only be used in a hypothetical/subjunctive case.

Doesn't it depend on the situation?
For instance, you might say, "He looked as if he were thirty years old." The implication is that he was not.
"Gee, officer, it appears/appeared to me as if he is/was thirty years old or so." You are simply estimating his age. Now, you might normally say "It appears to me that he is..." but I don't believe that the use of "as if" is incorrect, is it?

Or, to give an example closer to yours, we might tell our team,
"Cheer for your other players as if you really hope to win!"
Again, there may be better ways to say this, but it is not incorrect, is it?
"Cheer for your other players as you really hoped to win!" This is somewhat ambiguous and could well mean that you assume that they don't, in fact, care about winning.

I hope others will shed some light on what is (for me, at least) a tricky situation. If I have been carrying a misconception around all these years I will be very grateful to be relieved of it!

[birdeen's call]

bertietheblue
Now you've got me totally lost So it's "like you didn't", not "like you don't"??

kfredson
What you say has surely something to it. I'm as surely not one to judge Interesting, I will also be very grateful for more comments on this topic.

[TheParser]

Native speakers often use "like" in sentences like:

Wave you hands in the air like you just don't care.
Oh, fine, like I care!

Is it considered good English? I guess using subjunctive in those "like" clauses would be hypercorrect?

********** NOT A TEACHER **********

Hello, Birdeen's Call.


(1) I have just returned from my daily walk and discovered with great

delight that two wonderful teachers have helped you and me.

(2) Teacher Kfredson is 100% correct: you can definitely use either

the subjunctive or non-subjunctive after as if/like -- depending on the

meaning you wish to give:

She looks as if she is rich. = Maybe she actually is rich!!!

He talks as if he were (was in popular English) rich. = But we know that

he is not rich.

These two examples come from Mr. Michael Swan's very popular

Practical English Grammar.

(3) Many years ago, the rule was quite strict, As if takes the subjunctive.

But speakers have broken away from this rigid rule because there are

times when you are talking about a fact. Teacher Kfredson gave some

examples that you can use as a model when you decide whether you

should use the subjunctive or non-subjunctive after as if/like.

(4) If we remember that many Americans use like instead of as if, it

seems that you have a wide choice of "good" English:

Wave your hands as if/ like you didn't/don't care. Apparently,

any combination is OK -- depending on your meaning.

If I understood Teacher Kfredson correctly:

Wave your hands as if/like you don't care = You really do not care!!!

Wave your hands as if/like you didn't care = You do care but you do not

want the other person to know your inner feelings.

(5) Thanks a million for your question. I learned so much. Namely, that

as if in modern English sometimes goes better with a non-subjunctive

verb.

Thank you

[birdeen's call]

(3) Many years ago, the rule was quite strict, As if takes the subjunctive.

But speakers have broken away from this rigid rule because there are

times when you are talking about a fact.

It was many years ago when I learned the rule - maybe that's why I was so struck by this information. I'm only wondering how come I never stumbled upon this construction. Maybe I just happened to pay no heed

Thanks a billion to Parser, Bertie, and Kfredson for sharing your knowledge with me!