Forum newsfeeds
Forum Newsfeeds


Sites for Teachers

Sites for Teachers


Go Back   UsingEnglish.com ESL Forum > Learning English > Editing & Writing Topics
Register FAQDonate Members List Mark Forums Read Tags

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old 06-Jul-2004, 01:03
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 4
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
bubu
Default help with "that" and meaning analysis

dear sir

I have just registered. My good greetings to you.

I have questions about the quoted lines.

I was discussing with my students a paragraph of a story. The story is about a boy who vanished. In the story a father comes to know that his new born child’s feet must not touch the earth until the child completes his 12th year otherwise the child will face big trouble.
“Great care was taken that this should be avoided.” [Extract from the original text]
So he appoints nurses to take care of the baby. Everything goes fine until he reaches his 12th year. The father becomes very happy and one day arranges a big feast to celebrate his son’s release. But while a nurse was carrying the baby a frightful unearthly yell distracts her attention and she drops the child on the ground and goes over to the window to sea what had caused the noise. But at the next moment-
“With a cry, she realized that she has disobeyed her master”. [Extract frm the orignl text]

This is how the story begins.

Now I would like to know the meaning and grammatical behaviour of the word “that” in the first indented sentence. Does it mean “so that”?

And in the second indented sentence I have this following question:

Doesn’t the sentence sound ambiguous?

“With a cry, she realized” I think may convey two different meanings 1] the cry made her realize or the cry was responsible to make he realize. 2] She realized her mistake and as a result uttered the cry [This is certainly the meaning the writer wants to convey]

Could you plz explain? Thanks

Bubu
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old 06-Jul-2004, 01:03
Newbie
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 4
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
bubu
Default help with "that" and meaning analysis

dear sir

I have just registered. My good greetings to you.

I have questions about the quoted lines.

I was discussing with my students a paragraph of a story. The story is about a boy who vanished. In the story a father comes to know that his new born child’s feet must not touch the earth until the child completes his 12th year otherwise the child will face big trouble.
“Great care was taken that this should be avoided.” [Extract from the original text]
So he appoints nurses to take care of the baby. Everything goes fine until he reaches his 12th year. The father becomes very happy and one day arranges a big feast to celebrate his son’s release. But while a nurse was carrying the baby a frightful unearthly yell distracts her attention and she drops the child on the ground and goes over to the window to sea what had caused the noise. But at the next moment-
“With a cry, she realized that she has disobeyed her master”. [Extract frm the orignl text]

This is how the story begins.

Now I would like to know the meaning and grammatical behaviour of the word “that” in the first indented sentence. Does it mean “so that”?

And in the second indented sentence I have this following question:

Doesn’t the sentence sound ambiguous?

“With a cry, she realized” I think may convey two different meanings 1] the cry made her realize or the cry was responsible to make he realize. 2] She realized her mistake and as a result uttered the cry [This is certainly the meaning the writer wants to convey]

Could you plz explain? Thanks

Bubu
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old 06-Jul-2004, 01:23
MikeNewYork's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Country: USA
Location: New York
First Language: American English
Posts: 6,095
Thanks: 0
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
MikeNewYork is an unknown quantity at this point
Default Re: help with "that" and meaning analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by bubu
dear sir

I have just registered. My good greetings to you.
Welcome to our forum.

Quote:
I have questions about the quoted lines.

I was discussing with my students a paragraph of a story. The story is about a boy who vanished. In the story a father comes to know that his new born child’s feet must not touch the earth until the child completes his 12th year otherwise the child will face big trouble.
“Great care was taken that this should be avoided.” [Extract from the original text]
So he appoints nurses to take care of the baby. Everything goes fine until he reaches his 12th year. The father becomes very happy and one day arranges a big feast to celebrate his son’s release. But while a nurse was carrying the baby a frightful unearthly yell distracts her attention and she drops the child on the ground and goes over to the window to sea what had caused the noise. But at the next moment-
“With a cry, she realized that she has disobeyed her master”. [Extract frm the orignl text]

This is how the story begins.

Now I would like to know the meaning and grammatical behaviour of the word “that” in the first indented sentence. Does it mean “so that”?
That would be one explanation. The conjunction "that" could be ellipsis of "so that". In that case, great care was taken for the reason that bad things didn't happen. There is another use of "that" as a conjunction -- its use to indroduce a subordinate clause of hope or desire. In that case, great care was taken in the hope that bad things didn't happen. In this use, the two possibilities are very close.



Quote:
And in the second indented sentence I have this following question:

Doesn’t the sentence sound ambiguous?

“With a cry, she realized” I think may convey two different meanings 1] the cry made her realize or the cry was responsible to make he realize. 2] She realized her mistake and as a result uttered the cry [This is certainly the meaning the writer wants to convey]

Could you plz explain? Thanks

Bubu
I would read the second sentence to have your second meaning. If the "cry" had been causal, I would not have expected it to begin with "with a cry".
__________________
Pope of the Dictionary.com Forum
Moderator of Delphi UsingEnglish Forum
and www.usingenglish.com
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old 06-Jul-2004, 01:23
MikeNewYork's Avatar
Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Country: USA
Location: New York
First Language: American English
Posts: 6,095
Thanks: 0
Thanked 6 Times in 6 Posts
MikeNewYork is an unknown quantity at this point
Default Re: help with "that" and meaning analysis

Quote:
Originally Posted by bubu
dear sir

I have just registered. My good greetings to you.
Welcome to our forum.

Quote:
I have questions about the quoted lines.

I was discussing with my students a paragraph of a story. The story is about a boy who vanished. In the story a father comes to know that his new born child’s feet must not touch the earth until the child completes his 12th year otherwise the child will face big trouble.
“Great care was taken that this should be avoided.” [Extract from the original text]
So he appoints nurses to take care of the baby. Everything goes fine until he reaches his 12th year. The father becomes very happy and one day arranges a big feast to celebrate his son’s release. But while a nurse was carrying the baby a frightful unearthly yell distracts her attention and she drops the child on the ground and goes over to the window to sea what had caused the noise. But at the next moment-
“With a cry, she realized that she has disobeyed her master”. [Extract frm the orignl text]

This is how the story begins.

Now I would like to know the meaning and grammatical behaviour of the word “that” in the first indented sentence. Does it mean “so that”?
That would be one explanation. The conjunction "that" could be ellipsis of "so that". In that case, great care was taken for the reason that bad things didn't happen. There is another use of "that" as a conjunction -- its use to indroduce a subordinate clause of hope or desire. In that case, great care was taken in the hope that bad things didn't happen. In this use, the two possibilities are very close.



Quote:
And in the second indented sentence I have this following question:

Doesn’t the sentence sound ambiguous?

“With a cry, she realized” I think may convey two different meanings 1] the cry made her realize or the cry was responsible to make he realize. 2] She realized her mistake and as a result uttered the cry [This is certainly the meaning the writer wants to convey]

Could you plz explain? Thanks

Bubu
I would read the second sentence to have your second meaning. If the "cry" had been causal, I would not have expected it to begin with "with a cry".
__________________
Pope of the Dictionary.com Forum
Moderator of Delphi UsingEnglish Forum
and www.usingenglish.com
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!
Reply With Quote
Reply
Tags: , , ,




Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
UNDERSTAND MEANING...please help Anonymous Ask a Teacher 3 08-Jun-2005 03:49
"What's the meaning of the phrase?" Cicily21 Ask a Teacher 3 24-Sep-2004 13:46
Meaning Anonymous Ask a Teacher 7 28-Oct-2003 01:45
Meaning of phrases. Piak General Language Discussions 14 30-May-2003 12:01
the difference between Past & P.P. in the meaning Anonymous Ask a Teacher 1 03-Feb-2003 15:06


All times are GMT. The time now is 03:25.



vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2008, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.1.0
Copyright © 2002 - 2008 UsingEnglish.com