Is it ever possible for a non-native to obtain the same level of English (at the brain-level)?

[Rhaight9]

Hi guys. I hope everyone's doing well. Just something I wondered and feared about…. I'm a non-native, I'd begun to be exposed to English at a rather late age as I wasn't really listening in English classes in school. Is there a threshold set by a certain age to how much English can be “registered” in the brain in terms of connections, etc.?;I do not mean speaking English but rather understanding it and the ability to construe English in your head…. I'm just worried that after a certain age, there is a threshold in terms of "integrating” English in the brain;Maybe my brain perceives a given text with a more ambiguity compared to a native's. I will never know, though. What do you guys think?

 

[jutfrank]

I'm not exactly sure what you're asking. Are you talking about syntax? The idea of a kind of cut-off point at a certain age is really much more to do with pronunciation than anything else.

If you perceive a text "with ambiguity", that could be down to your lack of grammatical awareness but I'd imagine it would be more likely to do with your understanding of the vocabulary used. If you want us to speculate further, you'll have to be more precise about exactly what you can't do, preferably with an example or two.

 

[Rhaight9]

If you perceive a text "with ambiguity", that could be down to your lack of grammatical awareness but I'd imagine it would be more likely to do with your understanding of the vocabulary used. If you want us to speculate further, you'll have to be more precise about exactly what you can't do, preferably with an example or two.

By this, I wasn't referring to a factual ambiguity, but rather a contemplation of whether I perceive and able to construe what a given text purports as a native. I don't know as I don't have anything to compare to.

 

[Tarheel]

For starters, you might want to stop using so many "big" words. For example, I am fairly sure that I have never seen the phrase "factual ambiguity" before. So far your text is a strange mixture of breezy informality and stiff formality.

You might want to join a chat room that's in English. Also, if you have Messenger you can use the voice feature, and you can have the person on the other end critique your pronunciation.

 

[Rhaight9]

For starters, you might want to stop using so many "big" words. For example, I am fairly sure that I have never seen the phrase "factual ambiguity" before. So far your text is a strange mixture of breezy informality and stiff formality.

You might want to join a chat room that's in English. Also, if you have Messenger you can use the voice feature, and you can have the person on the other end critique your pronunciation.

I apologize. I was referring to the fact I don't necessary feel personal actual ambiguity but rather pondering if there's one compared to natives when construing texts and concepts in English.

 

[Tarheel]

I apologize. I was referring to the fact I don't necessary feel personal actual ambiguity but rather pondering if there's one compared to natives when construing texts and concepts in English.

That's very unnatural, and it's unclear what you're trying to say.

I'm not sure what you mean by "construing texts". I suggest that you use everyday words.

 

[Rhaight9]

That's very unnatural, and it's unclear what you're trying to say.

I'm not sure what you mean by "construing texts". I suggest that you use everyday words.

Sorry, basically what I meant was that I wonder whether there is a difference between how I , a non-native construe concepts in english and a native.

By ambiguity I was referring to the potential difference when interpretating a given text between me and a native.

 

[Tarheel]

Sorry, basically what I meant was that I wonder whether there is a difference between how I , a non-native construe concepts in english and a native.

By ambiguity I was referring to the potential difference when interpretating a given text between me and a native.

So far you are not taking my advice.

I'm not sure if you're talking about grammar and syntax and things like that or ideas (concepts) in general.

As far as interpreting text, I understand that to mean reading something and understanding it. (I could be mistaken.)

 

[Rhaight9]

I'm talking about

So far you are not taking my advice.

I'm not sure if you're talking about grammar and syntax and things like that or ideas (concepts) in general.

As far as interpreting text, I understand that to mean reading something and understanding it. (I could be mistaken.)

I'm talking about Grammar, syntax and the general ability to take away and infer from a given text.

 

[emsr2d2]

I'm talking about grammar, syntax and the general ability to take away and infer information from a given text.

 

[emsr2d2]

I think it all depends on the text. If you reach a very high level of English, you'd probably be able to extrapolate information from a technical text, or a work of fiction, as well as a native speaker. You might not do it as instantaneously, but you could still do it.
I think the difference/difficulty would come, for someone learning English only as an adult, with the sort of informal, casual, perhaps jokey communication that takes place between people who grew up in the same country. There are always, in my opinion, nuances of any language that will evade anyone except a native speaker.

 

[Rhaight9]

I think the difference/difficulty would come, for someone learning English only as an adult, with the sort of informal, casual, perhaps jokey communication that takes place between people who grew up in the same country. There are always, in my opinion, nuances of any language that will evade anyone except a native speaker.

Here's a link to an article that purports such difference in understanding text between Native speakers and Non-native speakers (Amongst scientists) https://www.nature.com/articles/d41...irst language is,per year just reading papers.

 

[Tarheel]

@Rhaight9
I'm not sure what you mean by "purports such difference". Also, I'm not sure if you are agreeing with @emsr2d2 or disagreeing.

 

[Rhaight9]

@Rhaight9
I'm not sure what you mean by "purports such difference". Also, I'm not sure if you are agreeing with @emsr2d2 or disagreeing.

I'm not disagreeing or agreeing- just contributing to the discussion. by purports such difference I was referring that the article suggests there is potentially a difference in understanding English between native English speakers scientists and non-native scientists.

 

[Piscean]

We don't use 'purport' in that way. https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/purport

 

[jutfrank]

I don't have access to the article. Can you tell us what it says? From the title alone, it seems the researchers measured only reading speed.

I have very little idea of what your question is really asking. Are you asking whether native speakers are more likely to be better readers? In the sense that they're faster and have deeper levels of comprehension?

Remember that comprehension (how well a reader can interpret a text) can vary hugely across a population of native speakers. There are many factors that might make one reader better than another, including the person's lexicon, their understanding of text organisation and genre, their learned reading skills, and their general intelligence.

 

[Rhaight9]

We don't use 'purport' in that way. https://www.collinsdictionary.com/dictionary/english/purport

I was worried about that- take a look at the second definition.-https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/purport

 

[Rhaight9]

I don't have access to the article. Can you tell us what it says? From the title alone, it seems the researchers measured only reading speed.

I have very little idea of what your question is really asking. Are you asking whether native speakers are more likely to be better readers? In the sense that they're faster and have deeper levels of comprehension?

Remember that comprehension (how well a reader can interpret a text) can vary hugely across a population of native speakers. There are many factors that might make one reader better than another, including the person's lexicon, their understanding of text organisation and genre, their learned reading skills, and their general intelligence.

I apologize. I haven't noticed I've accessed it through my university.
I believe this article is referring to the same study-https://theconversation.com/non-native-english-speaking-scientists-work-much-harder-just-to-keep-up-global-research-reveals-208750

And yes, this is one way to put it. basically what I'm wondering (and worrying) about is whether even if you account all these variables is there still an unreachable barrier between non-native speakers and native speakers? (as a results of the early exposure)

 

[jutfrank]

As I said, the article's title seems only to suggest that non-native speakers spend more time reading and writing papers than natives. That's not obviously related to comprehension, which is what you mean. Again, I don't know what the findings are, so I may be wrong.

And yes, this is one way to put it. basically what I'm wondering (and worrying) about is whether even if you account all these variables is there still an unreachable barrier between non-native speakers and native speakers? (as a results of the early exposure)

Not necessarily, no. It's quite possible for a non-native speaker to reach the reading comprehension level of an average native speaker, though of course any non-native does have a language barrier to contend with.

 

[probus]

I was able to read the whole article free of charge by using Google Scholar's link to researchgate.net