Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

[lagoo]

Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

In Chinese (my mother tongue), it's crazy to consider "hardship" as a countable noun.
I have been told that the best way to master a foreign language is (to??I'm not sure if 'to' is needed) know their way of thinking.

So when native English speakers use "hardships" or "a hardship", what is exactly in their mind if compared in Chinese the countable nouns mean only things that you can see with your eyes?

 

[Raymott]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

If you are going to use your method of knowing our way of thinking, and you see 'hardships', then you must infer that English speakers do not consider that only nouns that you can see can be countable. I think that was your question.

"is to know their thinking" is preferable.
If you can imagine someone suffering many hardships over the last few years (loss of a job, then father dies, then husband gets cancer), then you will know how we think about hardships. It's also possible to say that the person has had a few years of hardship, but each of these episodes is a hardship.

 

[lagoo]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

If you can imagine someone suffering many hardships over the last few years (loss of a job, then father dies, then husband gets cancer), then you will know how we think about hardships.

On the contrary, if this guy has enjoyed many happy occasions over the last few years (job promotion, win a lottery, then a family member gets recovered from cancer), why wouldn't you think about "hapinesses"?

 

[PaulMatthews]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

In Chinese (my mother tongue), it's crazy to consider "hardship" as a countable noun.
I have been told that the best way to master a foreign language is (to??I'm not sure if 'to' is needed) know their way of thinking.

So when native English speakers use "hardships" or "a hardship", what is exactly in their mind if compared in Chinese the countable nouns mean only things that you can see with your eyes?

Count nouns by definition are those that can combine with the cardinal numbers one, two, three etc.

One can hardly say, for example, *"I suffered seven hardships", so "hardship" has to be a non-count noun, just as it is in your native language.

 

[jutfrank]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

Count nouns by definition are those that can combine with the cardinal numbers one, two, three etc.

One can hardly say, for example, *"I suffered seven hardships", so "hardship" has to be a non-count noun, just as it is your native language.

That's not an English teacher's definition. Countable nouns may also combine with other determiners like a/many/each. It's natural to say many hardships.

 

[Raymott]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

On the contrary, if this guy has enjoyed many happy occasions over the last few years (job promotion, win a lottery, then a family member gets recovered from cancer), why wouldn't you think about "hapinesses"?

So, you've changed your methodology? It's not how English-speakers think; it's why they think that way? I don't think, in the case of countable/uncountable nouns, there is "way of thinking" that will help you.

 

[YAMATO2201]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

One can hardly say, for example, *"I suffered seven hardships", so "hardship" has to be a non-count noun, just as it is your native language.

Typo? I would say "just as it is in your native language".

 

[Tdol]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

So when native English speakers use "hardships" or "a hardship", what is exactly in their mind if compared in Chinese the countable nouns mean only things that you can see with your eyes?

Native English speakers do not compare things to rules in Chinese or other languages. Working back from Chinese to English will not result in a perfect understanding. When the rules are different, don't try to apply the logic of your first language.

 

[PaulMatthews]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

That's not an English teacher's definition. Countable nouns may also combine with other determiners like a/many/each. It's natural to say many hardships.

But the fact that it can take a determiner like "many" doesn't make it a count noun.

It has to be specifically capable of combining with the cardinal numbers to qualify as a count noun (that's why such nouns are called 'count nouns') which I don't think it is.

Do you really think it's OK to say something like "I have suffered eleven hardships"?

 

[GoesStation]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

Your rule would result in three categories of nouns. One of them would be count nouns for things that can be qualified by a cardinal number. The rest would be divided between nouns that can't take a plural and nouns that can take a plural but don't qualify as count nouns.

Would learning this three-way classification help students more than a two-way division between countable nouns that can take a plural and non-countable nouns that can't?

 

[jutfrank]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

But the fact that it can take a determiner like "many" doesn't make it a count noun.

Do you really think it's OK to say something like "I have suffered eleven hardships"?

It doesn't sound natural, no. Do you think it's not okay to say I have suffered many hardships?

I'm not exactly sure what you're implying. Do you mean that a noun can be plural and uncountable at the same time?

It has to be specifically capable of combining with the cardinal numbers to qualify as a count noun (that's why such nouns are called 'count nouns') which I don't think it is.

What do you mean by "I don't think it is". Where does the uncertainty come from? By which criteria are you judging this? Surely the native-speaker decides what is capable of combining with what. We use natural but ungrammatical language all the time.

 

[PaulMatthews]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

It doesn't sound natural, no. Do you think it's not okay to say I have suffered many hardships?

I'm not exactly sure what you're implying. Do you mean that a noun can be plural and uncountable at the same time?



What do you mean by "I don't think it is". Where does the uncertainty come from? By which criteria are you judging this? Surely the native-speaker decides what is capable of combining with what. We use natural but ungrammatical language all the time.

There's no uncertainty in my mind.

I gave you the criteria.

I'll spell it out: "hardship" has no established use as a count noun. That clear enough for you?

If you consider that expressions like "I suffered eleven hardships" is OK, then that's a matter for you, but I find it unacceptable.

 

[emsr2d2]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

I wouldn't use "hardship" countably either.

I have suffered hardship eleven times in my life.

 

[PaulMatthews]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

Your rule would result in three categories of nouns. One of them would be count nouns for things that can be qualified by a cardinal number. The rest would be divided between nouns that can't take a plural and nouns that can take a plural but don't qualify as count nouns.

Would learning this three-way classification help students more than a two-way division between countable nouns that can take a plural and non-countable nouns that can't?

Number and countability are closely related but are different concepts.

There are some plural nouns that are non-count, e.g. "scissors", "trousers", belongings".

And some nouns are always count, and some are always non-count. And there are some that have abstract concepts which are non-count in the primary sense that have a secondary sense denoting an event denoting an event, and are countable:. One of my grammars has these examples:

Considerable injustice was revealed during the enquiry. (abstract, noun-count)
Two fundamental injustices were revealed during the enquiry. (event, count)

So it's not a simple matter of two kinds of nouns.

 

[teechar]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

It has to be specifically capable of combining with the cardinal numbers to qualify as a count noun

She barely managed to get through one hardship before she was plunged into another.


How about that?

 

[jutfrank]

Re: Why can "hardship" be a countable noun while "happiness" uncountable?

I'll spell it out: "hardship" has no established use as a count noun. That clear enough for you?

Well, thank you for spelling it out. And thank you for your opinion. I'm happy that it works for you.