Beyond the pale

[asadok]

Just worked this one out-
'Beyond the pale' means completely outside what a person or group thinks is acceptable to to say, think or do.
The origin of the idiom is easy to understand if you know that a pale is another word for a bucket, and would be used to lift water from a well. The phrase comes from the idea that the water is out of reach of the bucket- just like an idea can be out of reach for some people.

[5jj]

Are you sure that you are an English teacher as you claim? The word with a similar meaning to 'bucket' is 'pail', not 'pale', and your explanation of the meaning of 'beyond the pale' is not too accurate.

[bhaisahab]

"A pale" or "paling" is a boundary. "Beyond the pale" means "outside the boundary".

[Barb_D]

Beyond the pale

[Tdol]

I have read that the pale was a reference to Ireland- the Pale of Dublin mentioned in the link above.

[bhaisahab]

I have read that the pale was a reference to Ireland- the Pale of Dublin mentioned in the link above.

"An Pháil Sheasanach" "The Saxon (English) Pale" was the area subjected to English rule in Ireland in the 16th century. It extended from Co. Louth, north of Dublin, to Co. Kildare to the south, and into parts of Co. Offaly to the west.

[birdeen's call]

"An Pháil Sheasanach" "The Saxon (English) Pale" was the area subjected to English rule in Ireland in the 16th century. It extended from Co. Louth, north of Dublin, to Co. Kildare to the south, and into parts of Co. Offaly to the west.

Do you know whether "páil" is just an irishized form of "pale" or an earlier borrowing from Latin?

[bhaisahab]

Do you know whether "páil" is just an irishized form of "pale" or an earlier borrowing from Latin?

I'm not sure, but I think it's direct from Latin.

[davidaleman]

'Beyond the pale' means outside the limits of acceptable behavior. 'beyond the pale' and 'beyond the pail' the phrase has nothing to do with buckets.The adjective meaning of word 'pale' is whitish and light in colour and the noun meaning of word 'pale' is a stake or pointed piece of wood.

[5jj]

'beyond the pale' and certainly not 'beyond the pail' the phrase has nothing to do with buckets.The adjective meaning of the word 'pale' is whitish and light in colour and the noun meaning of thr word 'pale' is a stake or pointed piece of wood.

Welcome to the forum, davidaleman.

If you are going to use words from another source, in this case the link provided by Barb, please
either quote them directly, and credit your source, or make sure that you paraphrase accurately - and still credit the source.

Original: "It's 'beyond the pale', and certainly not 'beyond the pail' - the phrase has nothing to do with buckets. The everyday use of the word 'pale' is as an adjective meaning whitish and light in colour (and used to that effect by Procol Harum and in countless paint adverts). This 'pale' is the noun meaning 'a stake or pointed piece of wood'". Beyond the pale