[Grammar] Future forms

dilodi83 · Aug 12, 2011

1) I'll come into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.
2) I'm going to come into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.
3) I'm coming into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.

Which of these three future forms is more correct? I think each one might sound good but 1 means that the speaker is making up his mind at that very moment when he's talking, 2 means that he wants to underline his intention to come into the office or his availability to come into there, 3 I think it could also be considered correct in this case because we have "on Saturday morning" which is a future indication, that we usually find with the present progressive.
Am I right?

The grammar book where I've taken this sentence from says that only 1 is correct...
What's your view about this?

Afit · Aug 12, 2011

I would - even unconsciously - use #1 and not use #2 and #3.

I am willing to come.... :up:

Raymott · Aug 12, 2011

dilodi83 said:
1) I'll come into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.
2) I'm going to come into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.
3) I'm coming into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.

Which of these three future forms is more correct? I think each one might sound good but 1 means that the speaker is making up his mind at that very moment when he's talking, 2 means that he wants to underline his intention to come into the office or his availability to come into there, 3 I think it could also be considered correct in this case because we have "on Saturday morning" which is a future indication, that we usually find with the present progressive.
Am I right?

The grammar book where I've taken this sentence from says that only 1 is correct...
What's your view about this?

Only 1. is right.
1. does not mean what you say. It can't. If you say you'll do something if someone else would like you to, by necessity you are postponing your decision to do it.
By contrast, in 2 and 3, the decision is already made, so the "if you like" condition is wrong.

Put another way, we don't say, "If you'd like me to, I'm doing .../I'm going to do ...." We say, "... I will do...."

billmcd · Aug 12, 2011

dilodi83 said:
1) I'll come into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.
2) I'm going to come into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.
3) I'm coming into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.

Which of these three future forms is more correct? I think each one might sound good but 1 means that the speaker is making up his mind at that very moment when he's talking, 2 means that he wants to underline his intention to come into the office or his availability to come into there, 3 I think it could also be considered correct in this case because we have "on Saturday morning" which is a future indication, that we usually find with the present progressive.
Am I right?

The grammar book where I've taken this sentence from says that only 1 is correct...
What's your view about this?

All three examples are acceptable as intentions about the future. As you have indicated #1: spur of the moment decision; #2 planned action; #3: present progressive with time reference. "If you like" is simply a polite afterthought.

Raymott · Aug 12, 2011

billmcd said:
All three examples are acceptable as intentions about the future. As you have indicated #1: spur of the moment decision; #2 planned action; #3: present progressive with time reference. "If you like" is simply a polite afterthought.

I can't see how you can justify this. Why do you consider "if you like" an afterthought? I see it as an integral part of the sentence. It turns a simple statement of intent into a conditional, depending on whether Peter wishes it or not.

How do you justify your opinion about the meaning of 1? The decision to come in to the office if Peter wanted me to could have been made a week ago, and I am just now telling him about it.

Students:
"I'm coming if you like" and "I'm going to come if you like" are not good English.
Nor is "I'll be coming if you like."
"I'll come if you like" is the usual way of expressing this.

billmcd · Aug 12, 2011

Raymott said:
I can't see how you can justify this. Why do you consider "if you like" an afterthought? I see it as an integral part of the sentence. It turns a simple statement of intent into a conditional, depending on whether Peter wishes it or not.

How do you justify your opinion about the meaning of 1? I don't have to justify my inference in the absence of a more descriptive context..The decision to come in to the office if Peter wanted me to could have been made a week ago, and I am just now telling him about it. But we don't know that, do we?

Students:
"I'm coming if you like" and "I'm going to come if you like" are not good English.
Nor is "I'll be coming if you like."
"I'll come if you like" is [STRIKE]the[/STRIKE] your opinion of the usual way of expressing this.

b.

5jj · Aug 12, 2011

billmcd said:
Raymott said:

"I'm coming if you like" and "I'm going to come if you like" are not good English.
Nor is "I'll be coming if you like."
"I'll come if you like" is[STRIKE] the[/STRIKE] your opinion of the usual way of expressing this.

Click to expand...

b

It's also the opinion of the five teachers (four British [including one retired] and one American) who are talking about this as I write.

Raymott · Aug 12, 2011

billmcd said:
"I'll come if you like" is [STRIKE]the[/STRIKE] your opinion of the usual way of expressing this.
b.

Of course; that goes without saying. I'm the one saying that it is the usual way of saying it, therefore it's my opinion. Usually, if I give someone else's opinion here, I cite references.
But back to the point: do you not agree that "If you like, I'll do ..." is far more common than any of the other choices?

5jj · Aug 12, 2011

I I have now deleted my careless posts. My apologies to anybody who was confused by them.

dilodi83 · Aug 12, 2011

Excuse me teachers,

I've just read all your posts and everything you've written with so much attention. Please correct me, if I have misinterpreted your words. The choice to use the three different forms of future depends on two factors in this case:
1) if I want to be quite formal (I have to use "will" in this context); if I want to be fairly informal and maybe not fully grammatically correct (I can use "to be going to" or "the present progressive);
2) if I assume and I mean that the desicion to go into the office has already been taken, I can use "to be going to" or "the present progressive, because it would be seen as an arrangements; otherwise, if I presume that the decision has not been taken yet, I have to use "will".

Have I caught the sense of what you were discussing? ;-)

Pokemon · Aug 12, 2011

) I'll come into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.
2) I'm going to come into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.
3) I'm coming into the office on Saturday morning if you like, Peter.

Only the first sentence is right. The speaker only wonders if the listener would like him to come. He couldn't have made the decision to come beforehand as he didn't know the opinion of his listener. So you can't interpret 'to come' as a planned action.

Raymott · Aug 12, 2011

dilodi83 said:
Excuse me teachers, I've just read all your posts and everything you've written with so much attention. Please correct me, if I have misinterpreted your words. The choice to use the three different forms of future depends on two factors in this case:
1) if I want to be quite formal (I have to use "will" in this context); if I want to be fairly informal and maybe not fully grammatically correct (I can use "to be going to" or "the present progressive);
Who was talking about formal or informal? Only one poster has suggested that you can use anything other than 1. for your sentence with "if you like" - and he has chosen not to argue further for that opinion. (Note that certain posts, and some responses have been removed). You might need to read it again.

2) if I assume and I mean that the desicion to go into the office has already been taken, I can use "to be going to" or "the present progressive, because it would be seen as an arrangements
Yes, but the decision hasn't been made. You've written some conditional sentences, and the decision depends on whether Peter wants it or not. If you remove "if you like Peter", you can use any of those phrases.
"I'm going in to the office; I'll be going in to the office ... " All OK
"I'm going in to the office if you like, Peter." - Not OK.

; otherwise, if I presume that the decision has not been taken yet, I have to use "will".
No. The use of "will" is not dependent on whether the decision has been made. It's dependent on whether you use "if you like, Peter" in the sentence. Since you do use it, you need "will"

Have I caught the sense of what you were discussing? ;-)

I don't think so. Which phrases you can use depends only on whether you want to discuss your original sentences with "if you like, Peter". I'm assuming you do, since you've provided the examples.
The possible phrases for the same sentence without "if you like, Peter" are different.

billmcd · Aug 12, 2011

Raymott said:
Of course; that goes without saying. I'm the one saying that it is the usual way of saying it, therefore it's my opinion. Usually, if I give someone else's opinion here, I cite references.
But back to the point: do you not agree that "If you like, I'll do ..." is far more common than any of the other choices?

Maybe more common. But far more common? Again, it depends on context and the surrounding conversation as to which statement could/would be used. And finally, here are Dilodi83's questions:

“Which of these three future forms is more correct?” Dilodi83 did not use the term “more usual”
“Am I right?” (dilodi83: that “each one might sound good?)
“What's your view about this?” (I posted my view.)

5jj · Aug 12, 2011

billmcd said:
Maybe more common. But far more common? Again, it depends on context and the surrounding conversation as to which statement could/would be used. And finally, here are Dilodi83's questions:

“Which of these three future forms is more correct?” Dilodi83 did not use the term “more usual”
“Am I right?” (dilodi83: that “each one might sound good?)
“What's your view about this?” (I posted my view.)

I think that Raymott covered the correctness question in post 5, where he wrote: "I'm coming if you like" and "I'm going to come if you like" are not good English.
Nor is "I'll be coming if you like."

Pokemon · Aug 12, 2011

billmcd said:
“Which of these three future forms is more correct?” Dilodi83 did not use the term “more usual”

'More correct' sounds as odd as 'more pregnant'. A woman is either pregnant or not, a sentence is either correct or incorrect.

[Grammar] Future forms

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