[Grammar] In The Lead

[rainynight]

I have a question on how to use the phrase "in the lead". I came up with several possible valid usages:
Situation 1: At a high school, two clubs, club A and club B, are trying to get as many students to join as possible. Currently club A has enrolled more students than club B:

1a: Club A is in the lead.

Situation 2: A referendum will take place soon, concerning whether an geographical area currently part of a sovereign country, should become an independent sovereign country. There are two political groups trying to influence voters. The pro-union group want voters to vote no. The pro-independence group want voters to vote yes. A poll of like voters was recently done, and it shows that there more voters more likely to vote no than yes:

2a: The pro-union group is in the lead.
2b: The no vote is in the lead.

Situation 3: Suppose there is a soccer match between Team USA and Team France.
At the match are American fans supporting Team USA and French fans supporting Team France. Then, Team USA scored a goal, going up 1-0:

3a: The American fans are in the lead.

Are the four sentences for respective situations (situation 2 has two sentences) okay English?

 

[Rover_KE]

Welcome to the forum, rainynight.

The default font size is adequate for most purposes.

2b is wrong. We don't say a vote is in the lead.

3a is wrong. The team is in the lead — not the fans.

 

[rainynight]

@Rover_KE

But you think there nothing with 2a?

 

[Matthew Wai]

We don't say a vote is in the lead.

Do you say a vote is in the majority?

But you think there nothing with 2a?

Do you mean 'But do you think there is nothing wrong with 2a?'

Not a teacher.

 

[Rover_KE]

We don't say a vote is in the majority.

There's nothing wrong with 2a.

 

[rainynight]

@Rover_RE

The pro-union group in situation 2 is related to the referendum the same way that the American fans in situation 3 are related to soccer(football) match. In situation 2, the pro-union group, outside of political activities urging people to vote no, are not a direct participant of the referendum. In situation 3, the American fans, outside of cheering on Team USA, are not direct participants of the soccer/football match. So, I am confused that sentence 2a is okay, but not sentence 3.

 

[Matthew Wai]

I think the pro-union group can indirectly participate by influencing voters and the group members can also directly participate by casting their votes, but the American fans cannot influence Team USA by cheering, not to mention participate in the match.

Not a teacher.

 

[Tarheel]

As for question 2:

We would, in this country (USA), find it perfectly acceptable to say that one side or the other is in the lead based either on polls or on actual vote count. (Note that I am a speaker of American English and that I don't claim to speak for everybody. It is possible that an AE speaker will disagree with me.)

"in the lead in the polls"


​

 

[rainynight]

Rover_RE claimed that sentence 2b is wrong. But then, I found this headline:

Scottish referendum: 'It's unlikely the yes vote was ever in the lead'

So, the headline must be wrong too?

 

[Tarheel]

Are you saying the Scots don't know how to write in English? ;-)

No, the headline is not wrong. In fact, it is consistent with what I said. (If that article is any indication, the usage is the same in the UK as it is in the USA.)

 

[rainynight]

@Tarheel

Rover_RE claimed that my sentence 2b in the first post:

2b: The no vote is in the lead.

is wrong. So, do you think sentence 2b is okay English?

 

[Tarheel]

It doesn't matter what I think. Usage is what is important. (Are you trying to start an argument between me and Rover?)

:-|

 

[lotus888]

Perhaps it may work if we enclosed "no" with quotation marks.

The "no" vote is in the lead.


--lotus

 

[Tarheel]

Perhaps it may work if we enclosed "no" with quotation marks.

The "no" vote is in the lead.


--lotus

We would do that anyway, lotus. (Not only was the "no" vote in the lead, but the "no" vote won the day. There probably won't be another such vote for decades.)

 

[Rover_KE]

I should have said 'I consider "The 'no' vote is in the lead" to be incorrect'.

I'll certainly choose my words more carefully if I ever respond again to this argumentative poster.

 

[rainynight]

Let's go back to an earlier question.

The pro-union group in situation 2 is related to the referendum the same way that the American fans in situation 3 are related to soccer(football) match. In situation 2, the pro-union group, outside of political activities urging people to vote 'no', are not a direct participant of the referendum. In situation 3, the American fans, outside of cheering on Team USA, are not direct participants of the soccer/football match. So, I am confused that sentence 2a is okay, but not sentence 3.

 

[Tarheel]

The voters would indeed be direct participants in the referendum. However, somebody who is rooting for a soccer team is not a member of the team and not a direct participant. If the team you are rooting for is ahead 1-0 they are in the lead, but you are not. That will, I hope, clarify things.

Simplify! Make simpler, shorter sentences.

 

[rainynight]

@Tarheel

But the "the pro-union group" are not ALL of the voters. I admit that members of that said pro-union group could individually vote, but the purpose of the pro-union group is to encourage voters to vote 'no'. So the pro-union group is not a direct participant.

 

[Tdol]

(Are you trying to start an argument between me and Rover?)

Probably- it's a troll.

 

[Tarheel]

@Tarheel

But the "the pro-union group" are not ALL of the voters. I admit that members of that said pro-union group could individually vote, but the purpose of the pro-union group is to encourage voters to vote 'no'. So the pro-union group is not a direct participant.

Your argument doesn't make sense. Nobody said the pro-union group is all of the voters. And you don't have to constitute all of the voters to participate.:roll:

Anyhow, if you are rooting for a team and your team is ahead you are likely to say, "We're winning." (I think I might have changed my mind, but that's allowed.)

:roll: