[Grammar] Sentence grammar - Though He slay me, yet will I trust Him.

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jutfrank

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Sometimes "yet" can be used as an adverb and in this case it is being used as an adverb to modify "will" and "trust"

Though He slay me, yet will I trust Him.
Subordinate, + main clause

Yes, that's how I analyse things.
 

Phaedrus

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. . . Quirk et al (1985 give an example, 'Though he is poor, yet he is satisfied with his situation'

I could have sworn I'd seen an example in there somewhere. I'm glad you found it, Piscean. Huddleston & Pullum (2002) don't seem to have any examples of the "(al)though . . . yet . . ." construction, which I analyze as a type of correlative construction. I think "yet" in "although . . . yet . . ." constructions works analogously to "then" in "if . . . then . . ." constructions, in which "then" is not needed, but can optionally be added.

In each case, we are dealing with some kind of adverb. Curme, in the quote I gave earlier, calls "yet" an "adversative" adverb in that construction, but I don't have any problem with the designation "conjunctive adverb." Indeed, we could call it an "adversative conjunctive adverb." In each case, too, the adverb can introduce the main clause only if the main clause comes second.

We can say "If it rains, (then) the pavement will be wet" and "The pavement will be wet if it rains," but we can't say: "[strike]Then the pavement will be wet if it rains[/strike]." Similarly, it wouldn't make sense to say, "[strike]Yet he is satisfied with his situation, though he is poor[/strike]." Although, like Piscean, I find the construction to be somewhat archaic, yet I am not sure that it can't be used today. :)

The most famous non-biblical example that has come to my mind is the concluding couplet of Andrew Marvell's poem "To His Coy Mistress" (1681): "Thus, though we cannot make our sun / Stand still, yet we will make him run." Of course, that poem was published during the same century as the King James Bible (1611). I have, however, found the construction in nineteenth-century American writings. Here are three examples:

"A tendency to speculation, though it may keep woman quiet, as it does man, yet makes her sad." (Nathaniel Hawthorne, The Scarlet Letter, 1851)
"Though somewhat resembling, yet she cannot properly be styled a quadroon, a class to which, I have omitted to mention, my mother belonged. (Solomon Northup, Twelve Years a Slave, 1853)
". . . I immediately said, 'O, I have only been up that way a piece,' in a manner intended to imply that although I might have been as far as New York, yet I wished it distinctly understood that I did not belong to that free state, nor to any other." (ibid.)
 

jutfrank

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Thus, though we cannot make our sun / Stand still, yet we will make him run.

What delicious alliteration. Thanks for that.

(And thanks of course to Mr. Marvell.)
 

HeartShape

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I found some of these articles quite interesting:

Here we connect the two sentences using an adverb clause of purpose. Adverb clauses of purpose are usually introduced by the subordinating conjunctions so that, so, that etc.

He is poor. He is honest.

Although he is poor he is honest.

Here the subordinating conjunction although shows concession or contrast.

And just to finally touch up on the main clause with the "yet".

I found this article interesting: Transition vs. conjunction

Azar (in Understanding... ) makes the following distinction:

It was hot. Therefore, we went swimming. (Transition)

It was hot, so we went swimming. (conjunction)

q1: Are 'therefore' and 'so' not conjunctions?
q2. Can we use both commas and full stops to introduce the second sentence in both examples?

And, but, yet, so, nor, and or are known as conjunctions, or coordinating conjunctions. Like transitions, they link two or more independent clauses. The punctuation before a conjunction is always a comma, except with very simple, brief ideas, in which case a comma is unnecessary.

Therefore belongs to a group of words known as transitions, sentence adverbs, conjuncts, or conjunctive adverbs. They express a meaning relation between the idea in the second of two independent clauses and the first one. Other transition words include consequently, however, furthermore, and nevertheless.

With transitions, the second of the two independent clauses is always preceded by either a period (full stop) or, more commonly, by a semicolon [;]. Although commas are sometimes used before the second clause in informal writing, they are not considered correct, standard written style.

Conjunctions have only one possible position--exactly between the two independent clauses. You can say

She hadn't given us any lunch, so we stopped at the first place we found

You can't put the so in any other location. For example, you can't say

*She hadn't given us any lunch, we so stopped at the first place we found

In contrast, Therefore and the other transitions may occupy more than one position in the second independent clause. They can occur

1) at the beginning of the second independent clause:

She hadn't given us any lunch; therefore we stopped at the first place we found

2) between the subject and the main verb of the second clause:

She hadn't given us any lunch; we therefore stopped at the first place we found (no commas)

3) after the subject and main verb of the second clause:

She hadn't given us any lunch; we stopped, therefore, at the first place we found (commas obligatory)

4) at the end of the second clause:

She hadn't given us any lunch; we stopped at the first place we found, therefore

It's always safe to use a comma before a conjunction (except with very short, simple ideas) and a semicolon before a clause with a transition.

Marilyn Martin

So my point is, "yet" isn't really acting like a conjunction at all.
 

Phaedrus

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I found this article interesting: Transition vs. conjunction

Azar (in Understanding... ) makes the following distinction:

It was hot. Therefore, we went swimming. (Transition)

It was hot, so we went swimming. (conjunction)

q1: Are 'therefore' and 'so' not conjunctions?
q2. Can we use both commas and full stops to introduce the second sentence in both examples?

And, but, yet, so, nor, and or are known as conjunctions, or coordinating conjunctions. Like transitions, they link two or more independent clauses. The punctuation before a conjunction is always a comma, except with very simple, brief ideas, in which case a comma is unnecessary.

Therefore belongs to a group of words known as transitions, sentence adverbs, conjuncts, or conjunctive adverbs. They express a meaning relation between the idea in the second of two independent clauses and the first one. Other transition words include consequently, however, furthermore, and nevertheless.

With transitions, the second of the two independent clauses is always preceded by either a period (full stop) or, more commonly, by a semicolon [;]. Although commas are sometimes used before the second clause in informal writing, they are not considered correct, standard written style.

Conjunctions have only one possible position--exactly between the two independent clauses. You can say

She hadn't given us any lunch, so we stopped at the first place we found

You can't put the so in any other location. For example, you can't say

*She hadn't given us any lunch, we so stopped at the first place we found

In contrast, Therefore and the other transitions may occupy more than one position in the second independent clause. They can occur

1) at the beginning of the second independent clause:

She hadn't given us any lunch; therefore we stopped at the first place we found

2) between the subject and the main verb of the second clause:

She hadn't given us any lunch; we therefore stopped at the first place we found (no commas)

3) after the subject and main verb of the second clause:

She hadn't given us any lunch; we stopped, therefore, at the first place we found (commas obligatory)

4) at the end of the second clause:

She hadn't given us any lunch; we stopped at the first place we found, therefore

It's always safe to use a comma before a conjunction (except with very short, simple ideas) and a semicolon before a clause with a transition.

Marilyn Martin
Do you know how to use quotation marks or block quotations, HeartShape?

Nearly 400 words of your above post were written by a former (and deceased) moderator of a different grammar site.
 

HeartShape

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Do you know how to use quotation marks or block quotations, HeartShape?

Nearly 400 words of your above post were written by a former (and deceased) moderator of a different grammar site.

That was quite unexpected. How did you find out she passed away?

I didn't think it matter much to use quotations. You seem to have gotten by OK.
 

HeartShape

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You know, now you mentioned of her passing, it's strange in a way because here we are talking about the Lord only to quote someone's writing then to find out she has passed away. Do you think she is trying to communicate to us?
 

GoesStation

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I didn't think it matters much to use quotations.
It's essential. Always mark quoted text with quotation marks or by setting it in italics.
 

Phaedrus

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That was quite unexpected. How did you find out she passed away?

Let's just say I have special knowledge about the forum you took the quotation from. She passed away a long time ago. I never knew her.
I didn't think it matter much to use quotations.

What you did was not exactly plagiarism (though I suppose that's debatable), because you said "I found this article interesting" and also included the author's name. The problem is that one can't tell where the boundary lies between your own words and "this article." Quotation marks and block quotations make that clear. In the case of long quotations, such as yours, a block quotation is called for. It also would have been good to state where you took the words from.

Returning to the main theme of this thread, I came upon two examples of the "though . . . yet . . ." construction the other day in Uncle Tom's Cabin (1852), by Harriet Beecher Stowe. I thought you and others following this thread might enjoy them. I shall use quotation marks. :)

"Though Mrs. Shelby had promised that the dinner should be hurried on table, yet it was soon seen, as the thing has often been seen before, that it required more than one to make a bargain." (from Chapter 7)

". . . for he well knew that although "Missis' orders" would undoubtedly be followed to the letter, yet he should gain a considerable deal by enlisting the spirit also." (from Chapter 8)
 

HeartShape

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Hi,

I just finished my chapter on analysing subordinates and conjunctions, and one question really thickens my gravy.

Wow. I now understand the subtle differences in meaning because adverb clause and preposition could easily be mixed up which was what happened today.

Let’s be clear here: "Though He slay me, yet will I trust Him." does not have a coordinating conjunction but there is the possibility that "yet" could be type of conjunction. The only type of conjunction it could be is a subordinating one. It's really is a grey area though.

Thought I will update on this, since it is a relatively quiet weekend with the exception of the world cup.
 
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