to be given / to have been given

[Nathan Mckane]

Howdy!

Would you please tell me what is the difference between these two sentences?

He was said to be given the prize last year.
He was said to have been given the prize last year.

Thanks very much.

 

[5jj]

Howdy!

Would you please tell me what is the difference between these two sentences?

He was said to be given the prize last year.
He was said to have been given the price last year.

The first is not acceptable.

The second is acceptable if the situation is:

He was said (at some time before now and after the giving) to have been given the prize.

The suggestion here may be that such a thing is no longer said.

 

[Nathan Mckane]

Thanks very much for your answer, would you please tell me why the first one is not acceptable?

Thanks again.

 

[5jj]

Thanks very much for your answer, would you please tell me why the first one is not acceptable?

I'll have to think about that - and pray that somebody else comes in quickly with an answer.;-)

 

[corum]

Howdy!

Would you please tell me what is the difference between these two sentences?

He was said to be given the prize last year.
He was said to have been given the prize last year.

The second sentence emphasizes the time sequence of reporting and the receiving of the prize. Both sentences are grammatical.

 

[bhaisahab]

The second sentence emphasizes the time sequence of reporting and the receiving of the prize. Both sentences are grammatical.

The first one is grammatical, but it doesn't mean anything. "My trousers eat mangoes while flying north for the winter" is grammatical, but....

 

[corum]

He was said [to be given the prize last year], but later it turned out that the genuine winner was someone else.

He was said [to be given the prize last year], and later it was officially confirmed that he was indeed the winner.

He was said [to be given the prize last year], but it turned out recently that it did not happen last year but happened two years ago.

 

[5jj]

He was said [to be given the prize last year], but later it turned out that the genuine winner was someone else.

He was said [to be given the prize last year], and later it was officially confirmed that he was indeed the winner.

He was said [to be given the prize last year], but it turned out recently that it did not happen last year but happened two years ago.

These sound very weird indeed to me.

 

[Raymott]

I agree that the first sentence is wrong.

Btw, corum, congratulations on having finally become native in English!

 

[Nathan Mckane]

I found your comment sarcastic, Raymott. Am I right?

 

[corum]

I found your comment sarcastic, Raymott. Am I right?

Yes.

 

[corum]

corum, congratulations on having finally become native in English!

Thereby hangs a tale.

 

[Raymott]

I found your comment sarcastic, Raymott. Am I right?

My first sentence about your topic was meant literally.

I'd prefer 'facetious' to 'sarcastic' for the second. 'Sarcastic' always carries negative connotations that don't always exit. So you might not have picked up the intended tone correctly. But, you are right in assuming that I don't believe a person's native language changes from Hungarian (for example) to English simply because one becomes fluent in the latter. Do you agree?

 

[5jj]

Thereby hangs a tale.

Well, I would like to hear it.

Some members find it helpful to know our membership type and native language when they consider how they should assess our answers.

If your native language is English, fine. If it is not, are you not misleading people?

Already your given country and location are strange, to say the least. If your native language can change without explanation, then can we believe there is any value in anything you write?

 

[BobK]

These sound very weird indeed to me.

Not just weird; wrong! Many people don't bother to use the past perfect passive infinitive in cases like these, and some people aver that this makes it right. :-( (Some non-native speakers may find a dictionary helpful with 'aver'. ;-) If they do, they should note the pronunciation (which doesn't rhyme with 'saver')

b

 

[corum]

Many people don't bother to use the [STRIKE]past[/STRIKE] perfect passive infinitive in cases like these, and some people aver that this makes it right.

Non-finite VPs are tenseless. :up:

 

[corum]

Well, I would like to hear it.

Many things like this:
https://www.usingenglish.com/forum/ask-teacher/124476-looking-adverb.html

Read through the thread.

 

[5jj]

Many things like this:
https://www.usingenglish.com/forum/ask-teacher/124476-looking-adverb.html

Read through the thread.

So you are saying that, because you feel that people who know you are not a native speaker may not accord your opinions the respect you feel they deserve, you are entitled to lie about your native language? Did I get that right?

 

[corum]

So you are saying that, because you feel that people who know you are not a native speaker may not accord your opinions the respect you feel they deserve, you are entitled to lie about your native language? Did I get that right?

No. I thought it was obvious: I cock a snook at this unfair native vs. non-native dichotomy, the them-and-us divide, that prevails among helpers at UE.

 

[5jj]

No. I thought it was obvious: I cock a snook at this unfair native vs. non-native dichotomy, the them-and-us divide, that prevails among helpers at UE.

And your idea of cocking a snook involves lying? That's an interesting approach. Well, there is no point whatsoever in continuing any discussion with you. because I can't trust you. 'bye.