Any informal term for these people?

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Mehrgan

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Hi all,
Though this may happen everywhere, it seems, at least as an stereotype, that people from the Middle East feel so possessive about their wives or female members of their families (or maybe due to some religious attitudes). I think the term 'possessive about' could be used here. Is there any informal term, slang, or idiom referring to such people? Especially if they're behaving over the top.

(Once I heard "redneck", which I don't think is the right word...)


Thanks in advance.
 

emsr2d2

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Hi all,
Though this may happen everywhere, it seems, at least as an stereotype, that people from the Middle East feel so possessive about their wives or female members of their families (or maybe due to some religious attitudes). I think the term 'possessive about' could be used here. Is there any informal term, slang, or idiom referring to such people? Especially if they're behaving over the top.

(Once I heard "redneck", which I don't think is the right word...)


Thanks in advance.

I think redneck has a different connotation but I'm sure an AmE speaker will confirm.

I'm not sure about the cultural/religious background of it (and I don't want to get embroiled in generalisations about certain parts of the world), but men who feel above women generally can be called:

Male chauvinists
Misogynists (although this an actual hatred of women)
Male chauvinist pig (this is a derogatory, informal phrase)

I don't think there was anything wrong with using "possessive". "Some men are very possessive of their wives" (the same can be said about some wives of their husbands, of course!)

The unfortunate spouse can be called "downtrodden", "under the thumb". Whichever spouse is seen to have all the power in a relationship is said to "wear the trousers"!
 

2006

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Hi all,
Though this may happen everywhere, it seems, at least as an stereotype, that people from the Middle East feel so possessive about their wives or female members of their families (or maybe due to some religious attitudes). I think the term 'possessive about' could be used here. Is there any informal term, slang, or idiom referring to such people? Especially if they're behaving over the top.


Thanks in advance.
I want to be sure I understand what you mean. Does "possessive" mean that the females are like property, with few rights compared to males, or do you mean that the males are very protective?
 

emsr2d2

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I want to be sure I understand what you mean. Does "possessive" mean that the females are like property, with few rights compared to males, or do you mean that the males are very protective?

I would say there's a big difference between possessive and protective.

A possessive spouse, I would say, treats the other person as property, wanting to control what they do, who they see, where they go etc.

A protective spouse is more considerate. They want to literally protect their partner from harmful situations, but in a good way.

Of course, it's possible that being over-protective can be just as smothering if it's taken to extremes, with the protective partner not wanting their spouse perhaps to drive alone etc, in case of accidents. But any normal person is usually protective of their partner, children etc.
 

Ouisch

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In AmE, "redneck" is a somewhat derogatory term for what some folks perceive to be a stereotypical poor white male farmer from the South (their necks are red from working outside in the sun all day). Comedian Jeff Foxworthy can probably describe the stereotype better than me:

You might be a redneck if...
...your Christmas ornaments are made out of spent shot-gun shells.

... people don't recognize your car without a dead animal on the hood.

...you've ever had to siphon gas from your lawn mower to put into your truck.


I live in the metro Detroit area which has a very high population of Middle Eastern immigrants, so I've heard several slang terms used to describe the possessive attitude Middle Eastern men appear (to Westerners) to have regarding their wives. However, as a rule any such term or nickname is certainly going to be offensive to the person you're describing, and it's best never to use them.
 

2006

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I would say there's a big difference between possessive and protective.
Of course there is. I'm not suggesting they are the same. I want to be sure if she means 'ownership' or something else.
2006
 

emsr2d2

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Apologies 2006. For some reason, I thought that the post to which I replied had been posted by the OP and was a question in response to my reply!!! I somehow completely missed the fact that it had been posted by you, and was actually aimed at the OP!

Oops! :-D
 

bertietheblue

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A possessive spouse, I would say, treats the other person as property

A possessive husband might demand total love and devotion from his wife and be jealous when this is wanting, but it's laying it on a bit thick to say that he treats her as 'property'.
 

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How fortunate for you that you've never met men who act that way. Men who call their wives every five minutes while they are over at the neighbor's house. Men who check the odometer of their wife's car to know if they deviated from their trip and from work by a tenth of a mile. Men who keep the money in a checking account that the wife doesn't have access to, and gives her money to buy groceries, demanding the receipt and change. If those men don't consider their wives property, I don't know what they think.
 

emsr2d2

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A possessive husband might demand total love and devotion from his wife and be jealous when this is wanting, but it's laying it on a bit thick to say that he treats her as 'property'.

Surely the words "possession" and "possessive" themselves suggest ownership, and therefore property.
 

bertietheblue

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Surely the words "possession" and "possessive" themselves suggest ownership, and therefore property.

No. That's a secondary meaning of 'possessive', in respect of things.

Possessive - demanding someone's total attention and love: she was possessive of her eldest son. (Oxford English Dictionary)

That's a long way from treating her son as property.

Possessive - showing a desire to own things and an unwillingness to share what one already owns: young children are proud and possessive of their own property.
 

bertietheblue

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Men who call their wives every five minutes while they are over at the neighbor's house. Men who check the odometer of their wife's car to know if they deviated from their trip and from work by a tenth of a mile. Men who keep the money in a checking account that the wife doesn't have access to, and gives her money to buy groceries, demanding the receipt and change. If those men don't consider their wives property, I don't know what they think.

What's the term for this logical fallacy?

It's where one person (me, in this case) asserts that X (possessiveness towards someone) is not Y (treating someone as property).

To which another person contests that Z (the text I have emboldened above) is Y (treating someone as property), and given that Z is Y, X must be Y because X and Z are the same - but of course this premise that they are the same is unproven.

In rhetoric, this is a useful tool because it diverts the audience's attention from the original argument to a more emotive argument which is difficult to contest.

I think the term for this specious line of reasoning is begging the question. If so, in this case Barb, you are guilty of begging the question that Z (what you wrote) is the same as X (possessiveness).
 

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How fortunate for you that you've never met men who act that way. Men who call their wives every five minutes while they are over at the neighbor's house. Men who check the odometer of their wife's car to know if they deviated from their trip and from work by a tenth of a mile. Men who keep the money in a checking account that the wife doesn't have access to, and gives her money to buy groceries, demanding the receipt and change. If those men don't consider their wives property, I don't know what they think.

I hope you're not speaking from experience!
 

bertietheblue

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Hi all,
Though this may happen everywhere, it seems, at least as an stereotype, that people from the Middle East feel so possessive about their wives or female members of their families (or maybe due to some religious attitudes). I think the term 'possessive about' could be used here. Is there any informal term, slang, or idiom referring to such people? Especially if they're behaving over the top.

(Once I heard "redneck", which I don't think is the right word...)


Thanks in advance.

One or two possibilities, depending on sense:

'Keep close guard of someone'
'keep a jealous eye over someone'

and if you mean a man who tyrannizes over his wife/daughters as if they were his servants:

'treat someone like chattel'
 

Over the top

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How fortunate for you that you've never met men who act that way. Men who call their wives every five minutes while they are over at the neighbor's house. Men who check the odometer of their wife's car to know if they deviated from their trip and from work by a tenth of a mile. Men who keep the money in a checking account that the wife doesn't have access to, and gives her money to buy groceries, demanding the receipt and change. If those men don't consider their wives property, I don't know what they think.

You will never find someone says his wife is a property but in reality he treats her so.
Here we use the term 'guardianship', every woman should have a male guardian doesn't matter how old she is, a 4 year old or a 40 year old that makes no difference.
They told us it's protection but in reality it's not. when a woman gets married her guardianship (i.e ownership) moves from her father to her husband, if she got divorced, it goes back to her father and so on. If her father is dead then the nearest male relative, her son for instance.
A woman can not get married, educate in school or university, work, travel, or even go or leave a hospital without her guardian (i.e owner) permission.
 

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Not my own, thank goodness.
 

emsr2d2

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You will never find someone says his wife is a property but in reality he treats her so.
Here we use the term 'guardianship', every woman should have a male guardian doesn't matter how old she is, a 4 year old or a 40 year old that makes no difference.
They told us it's protection but in reality it's not. when a woman gets married her guardianship (i.e ownership) moves from her father to her husband, if she got divorced, it goes back to her father and so on. If her father is dead then the nearest male relative, her son for instance.
A woman can not get married, educate in school or university, work, travel, or even go or leave a hospital without her guardian (i.e owner) permission.

I am eternally grateful that I don't live in such a society, but to get back to the original question - in a society where the above is not the normal state of affairs, a man who treated his wife/partner in a similar way would absolutely be referred to as "possessive". It is unlikely to stretch to such extremes as the above, but BarbD's description of some men who check the car's odomoter etc would be the exact description of a possessive husband. I would personally go so far as to call it abusive, but admittedly I don't think that necessarily fits with the OP's question.
 

Mehrgan

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I want to be sure I understand what you mean. Does "possessive" mean that the females are like property, with few rights compared to males, or do you mean that the males are very protective?


Hi,

Property?!!!! Not at all!!! It could be out of love. Say, some love their wives so much that even can't stand anyone else looking at them!
 

Mehrgan

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How fortunate for you that you've never met men who act that way. Men who call their wives every five minutes while they are over at the neighbor's house. Men who check the odometer of their wife's car to know if they deviated from their trip and from work by a tenth of a mile. Men who keep the money in a checking account that the wife doesn't have access to, and gives her money to buy groceries, demanding the receipt and change. If those men don't consider their wives property, I don't know what they think.



Dear Barb_D,
I do agree with you. However, at least in my country, and despite what you might hear from our politicians, the society think highly of women (though exceptions DO exist!). And in my question I meant a positive context when men DO love their wives and it's important what happens to them. Thank you for considering the post. All the best...
 

emsr2d2

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Hi,

Property?!!!! Not at all!!! It could be out of love. Say, some love their wives so much that even can't stand anyone else looking at them!

That may be the case, but surely that does not give that man the right to stop his wife going outside, just in case another man looks at her? It should be the woman's decision whether she goes out or not. If other men look at her, so what?! It's flattering!

I'm afraid it still sounds like ownership/property/possession to me, regardless of whether or not the man argues that it stems from feelings of love. The result may be the same, regardless of the reason.
 
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