Secondary Modern School refers to which grade?

[Ninth]

Dear Teachers,

If an educational background of one of an English staff stated "Secondary Modern School", it refers to which grade. In Thailand, before going to university, we learn 6 years in Primary school (Grade 1-6) and another 6 years in Secondary school (Grade 7-12).

Kindly give me your advice, please. Thank you very much.

 

[Tdol]

It's unclear to me- a Secondary Modern was a type of school, so it would depend on what exams the person took there:
Secondary modern school - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Ninth]

Dear Khun Tdol,

Thanks for your reply. I think it is not polite to ask him what grade he was graduated, but if there is no choice I may have to ask.

Thank you.

 

[BobK]

Note that the question 'What grade did you graduate?' is meaningless in Br Eng. Leaving a Secondary Modern School was never 'graduating'. 'Graduating' is something that happens to university students.

b

 

[Barb_D]

If you are interviewing a person for a job or for an assignment, you don't have to worry about whether it is "polite" to ask about their educational background. That is part of their qualifications. It's not personal -- it's business.

 

[konungursvia]

If it says secondary, in the school context, it is probably from ages 14 to 18 roughly speaking.

 

[5jj]

In England, primary schools are for children aged 5 to 11, secondary for children aged 11 to 16/18.

 

[konungursvia]

Actually, the article says this type of school "was designed for the majority of pupils - those who do not achieve scores in the top 25% of the eleven plus examination." So it seems they were an A-level variant or substitute, for those aged 16-18 or so.

 

[BobK]

Actually, the article says this type of school "was designed for the majority of pupils - those who do not achieve scores in the top 25% of the eleven plus examination." So it seems they were an A-level variant or substitute, for those aged 16-18 or so.

In those Secondary Moderns that had a Sixth Form, A levels were generally not on the menu. They offered vocational things like the HNCs (Higher National Certificate); but many had no provision for 16-18 year-olds - acting as 'feeder schools' for Technical Colleges and Polytechnics. (Note: these terms are all obselete; educational policy in the UK is measured in Revolutions per Minute.)

Some pupils went to a Grammar School to do A levels. But many people left Secondary Moderns as soon as they legally could, and with no qualifications at all - the moment they turned 16 (not even completing their last year).

b

 

[emsr2d2]

I was under the impression that a Secondary Modern took pupils from 12 to 16 (same as high school and secondary school). I thought it was the old name for a school that wasn't a grammar school (which took pupils from 11 to 16).

 

[5jj]

I was under the impression that a Secondary Modern took pupils from 12 to 16 (same as high school and secondary school). I thought it was the old name for a school that wasn't a grammar school (which took pupils from 11 to 16).

Children went to grammar or secondary modern schools at the same age - 11. Those who passed the eleven plus went to the grammar school, those who didn't went to the secondary modern. In some counties there were also secondary technical schools. All three types were in the secondary sector, i.e. education from the age of eleven.

Secondary modern and grammar schools (and the few technical schools) have largely been replaced by comprehensive schools - which are also secondary schools.

 

[emsr2d2]

Children went to grammar or secondary modern schools at the same age - 11. Those who passed the eleven plus went to the grammar school, those who didn't went to the secondary modern. In some counties there were also secondary technical schools. All three types were in the secondary sector, i.e. education from the age of eleven.

Secondary modern and grammar schools (and the few technical schools) have largely been replaced by comprehensive schools - which are also secondary schools.

Ah, perhaps that was before my time. When I went to school (or at least in the county where I went to school!), first school was 5-8, middle school was 8-12 and secondary school was 12-16. If you took the 11+ and passed, you left middle school a year earlier than your peers and went to grammar school.

 

[5jj]

Ah, perhaps that was before my time.

I am only too aware of my advanced age; you don't have to rub it in.

Some counties did change to a first, middle and upper/high (=secondary) system in the late 60s. The original grammar/secondary modern system started with Butler's Education Act 1944 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Ninth]

Note that the question 'What grade did you graduate?' is meaningless in Br Eng. Leaving a Secondary Modern School was never 'graduating'. 'Graduating' is something that happens to university students.

b

Dear Khun BobK,

It is my very first time to learn that "graduate" is used for university student only. Kindly advise what is the right word for students who finish primary and secondary school. Thank you very much.

Thank you very much for all of other kind comments as well. I do appreciate it.

 

[Tdol]

You just finish school. In the UK, it's about the exams you take that are your qualifications, like A Levels, GCSEs, etc.

 

[Tdol]

Ah, perhaps that was before my time. When I went to school (or at least in the county where I went to school!), first school was 5-8, middle school was 8-12 and secondary school was 12-16. If you took the 11+ and passed, you left middle school a year earlier than your peers and went to grammar school.

As I understand it, Middle Schools were only in some areas and not nationwide. Where I grew up, there was primary and secondary only, I think.

 

[5jj]

You just finish school. In the UK, it's about the exams you take that are your qualifications, like A Levels, GCSEs, etc.

My father and most of his friends left school at 14, with no qualifications at all.
I left school at 16.
I left school after I got my GCSEs.
After my A levels, I took a year out before going to uni.
Few people leave school these days without some bit of paper, even if it's only one GCSE.

 

[konungursvia]

Dear Khun BobK,

It is my very first time to learn that "graduate" is used for university student only. Kindly advise what is the right word for students who finish primary and secondary school. Thank you very much.

Thank you very much for all of other kind comments as well. I do appreciate it.

In AmE, we do tell kids they "graduate" from each level of school to go on to the next.

 

[BobK]

In AmE, we do tell kids they "graduate" from each level of school to go on to the next.

That makes sense etymologically speaking - as 'graduating' is just taking a step (Latin gradus). But when did sense have anything to do with Br Eng? ;-)

You just finish school. In the UK, it's about the exams you take that are your qualifications, like A Levels, GCSEs, etc.

:up: But in Ninth's case (a Secondary Modern) neither of those is likely. In subjects in which Secondary Modern children showed academic ability they took GCEs; in other subjects they took CSEs. The two qualifications were combined (GCE + CSE -> GCSE) after Secondary Moderns were phased out. (In fact - though I wasn't that interested in educational policy at the time, so can't say for sure - I wouldn't be surprised if the two were related: 'Secondary Moderns and CSEs are badges of an outdated attitude to academic ability: phase out the one and restructure/rename the other.')

b

 

[emsr2d2]

I am only too aware of my advanced age; you don't have to rub it in.

Some counties did change to a first, middle and upper/high (=secondary) system in the late 60s. The original grammar/secondary modern system started with Butler's Education Act 1944 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Oops - sorry, wasn't rubbing it in!! ;-)

Yes, in BrE we say "leave school" if we're not talking about university.

When did you leave school?
When I was 16/18.
I left school at 18, worked for a few years but then decided to go to university when I was 25, as a mature student.