[Grammar] You have to take the decision, not ME/I.

[Sahil Dhankhar]

This is not my homework.

I think out of the following sentences, only the first one is correct. Am I right?
1-You have to take this decision, not I.
2-You have to take this decision, not me.

 

[jutfrank]

After dozens of your posts I still don't know what you mean by 'correct'. Correct to what?

People say number 2, not number 1.

 

[emsr2d2]

The first is grammatically correct but rarely heard. The second is what the vast majority of native speakers actually say.

 

[Sahil Dhankhar]

Correct to the standards of British English Grammar.

 

[Sahil Dhankhar]

I think this is the same case as of the sentence given below.

1-I am better than him. (I think this is vastly spoken but still (it) is the case of faulty comparison of a subjective pronoun with an objective pronoun)
2-I am better than he. (This is grammatical as a subjective pronoun is compared with another subjective pronoun )

Based on the sentence 2, I think that "You have to take this decision, not I" should be correct as in this sentence comparison of a subjective pronoun is done with another subjective pronoun.
I think if we write the same sentences as- "You have to take this decision, not me.", the suggested link is between "decision" and "me" and that I think is not a valid link.
However,
You should thank him, not me. (Correct as here the comparison or link is between two objective pronouns "him" and "me")(The sentence can be expanded as- You should thank him and you should not thank me.)

You should thank him, not I. (Correct as here the comparison or link is between two subjective pronouns "you" and "I") (The sentence can be expanded as- You should thank him and I should not thank him.)

Kindly tell me if I have grasped some point incorrectly.

 

[emsr2d2]

Correct to the standards of British English grammar.

A better way of phrasing that would be "Is it natural in BrE?"

 

[jutfrank]

Correct to the standards of British English Grammar.

We've gone over the problems with this notion. Are you suggesting that something that nearly everybody would naturally say is incorrect?

 

[GoesStation]

You can find plenty of old grammar books that say that me is always wrong in that sentence. Grammarians used to try to make English speakers say things like You have to take this decision, not I based on a faulty analysis. When English speakers say me in that sentence, they are using a disjunctive pronoun which can be used as an object or, under certain circumstances, a subject pronoun.

My advice is to ignore the old grammar books and accept the disjunctive pronoun.

 

[jutfrank]

Kindly tell me if I have grasped some point incorrectly.

Every thing you said was reasonable but the essential point that you fail to grasp is the notion of what is meant by 'correct'. I really don't wish to offend you, but your idea of grammatical correctness is problematic, unuseful, and decades out of date.

 

[GoesStation]

Are you suggesting that something that nearly everybody would naturally say is incorrect?

Exactly. If a grammar book makes such an assertion, it's the book that's incorrect—not the speakers.

 

[Sahil Dhankhar]

Not at all. But the exponentially relaxing grammar rules have made many things vague for non native speakers. "Grammar ain't no saint."

 

[Sahil Dhankhar]

Sadly, I have said many times, it's not my choice to nitpick this much. It's the fault of the system here. (I am talking about the grammatical part of the competitive tests). I request you to be patient and help me like always as I don't do it unnecessarily.

 

[Sahil Dhankhar]

Sure, thanks for pointing out the concept of disjunctive pronoun.

 

[jutfrank]

Sadly, I have said many times, it's not my choice to nitpick this much. It's the fault of the system here. (I am talking about the grammatical part of the competitive tests). I request you to be patient and help me like always as I don't do it unnecessarily.

Sure. Of course we want to help.
I'm just asking you to bear in mind that we might not agree with what the assessors of your competitive tests would consider 'correct', whether grammatically or otherwise.

I wonder which of the two forms they would consider correct—not me, or not I? Do you actually know?

 

[Skrej]

Pronoun issue aside, I'm concerned with 'take' a decision. Without some very narrow, limited context, decisions are usually 'made' not 'taken'.

What do you mean by someone having to 'take' a decision?

 

[Sahil Dhankhar]

Thanks for pointing this out.

 

[Sahil Dhankhar]

"I wonder which of the two forms they would consider correct—not me, or not I? Do you actually know?"

If i knew, I wouldn't ask it here in the forum. But most probably, like some member said that "Not I" can't be said incorrect, test makers may decide it to be correct as they need the "fine line" to play with.

 

[emsr2d2]

The problem with such questions is that the people who set them sometimes have a specific answer in mind and don't know/realise or they forget that both answers are equally possible in natural English as used by native speakers.

 

[TheParser]

But the exponentially relaxing grammar rules have made many things vague for non native speakers.

NOT A TEACHER


Hello, Sahil Dhankhar:

The teachers in this thread have given excellent advice to our fellow members, who want to use English as it is spoken in 2018.

As an 81-year-old native speaker, however, I personally try to follow traditional rules (at least in writing).

So I would definitely try to say/write "You, not I, have to make the decision" or "You have to make the decision, not I."

It is my opinion that traditional rules should be followed at least in formal writing.

 

[Sahil Dhankhar]

Thank you very much. I really appreciate this reply and was waiting for a reply like this. It would be very nice of you if you keep helping me out like this.
81 years is a fantastic number and I pray to God that you be healthy and happy all the forthcoming years.