[General] British and American combination

[Rihan]

Can an advanced student Combine British English with American English?
Though My level would be intermediate or less, I need some advice and information about this.
The combination of language may be like that first sentence is American and the next is British .
If it is not considered as goof English , what Should we do?

 

[Rihan]

For an instance ,an advanced( ESL) student told his first sentence in American English I like cookies and then he or she told another sentence or sentences in British English .
So my concern is : Is this considered as perfect English or not? If not is the answer , then what can we do about that to improve the English language?

 

[SoothingDave]

I think a student should adopt one style and stay with that, unless a particular phrase or term is needed from the other dialect.

 

[Ouisch]

For an instance ,an advanced( ESL) student told his first sentence in American English I like cookies and then he or she told another sentence or sentences in British English .
So my concern is : Is this considered as perfect English or not? If not is the answer , then what can we do about that to improve the English language?

One problem might be if the speaker reverts to BrE later in the conversation and mentions "biscuits" instead of "cookies." (Two different foods in AmE.) To be honest, a person mixing BrE and AmE in the same conversation would probably be understood, but it would not sound like natural conversation: "I just got back from my summer vacation. I spent a fortnight traveling through Alaska and the Arctic Circle. It was chilly, even for July, and I'm glad I'd stashed a heavy sweater in the trunk of our rental car. I wasn't expecting so much mud, though, and I finally had to buy a pair of Wellies." Some of the words in that passage might be confusing to Brits/Americans.


If an advanced student wants to sound professional and fluent, he should probably stick to one or the other, either BrE or AmE.

 

[emsr2d2]

I would be much more impressed (and would consider you an advanced student) if you could differentiate between the two varieties, easily tell the difference between them and even translate from one to the other (yes, I know they're not technically two different languages but ...)

A discarded faucet lay on the sidewalk near the curb. It was only a couple hundred yards to my rental car so I picked up the faucet and then stashed it in the trunk. I took the freeway back to my condo, went inside, took off my pants and then put the faucet in the icebox.

A discarded tap lay on the pavement near the kerb. It was only a couple of hundred yards to my hire car so I picked up the tap and hid it in the boot. I went back on the motorway to my apartment, went inside, took off my trousers and then put the tap in the freezer.

 

[Tdol]

English exams recommend being consistent, and it may sound strange if someone switches between variants all the time. I would try to stick with one- using the odd word or expression won't make much difference, but changing every sentence or so will make things hard to follow. Using cookies in BrE wouldn't be a problem- you hear people using the word.

 

[waflob]

As already mentioned, consistency is advised. The problem with switching back and forth between the two, is that you may confuse people. The fact that the two languages have different words for the same thing is not unexpected.

At the time when Webster was making his (deliberately different) dictionary, many things that are commonplace today hadn't been invented yet. So when new things were invented / discovered, it is not unusual that they (seperately and independently) chose different words. As an example, early American cars must have had a very strange design, as it seems that the back of those cars resembled the front of an elephant :shock:;-) (trunk)

The problems you will encounter when mixing the two, is when the same word has different meanings - people might not always know what you mean. For some reason, the word 'rubber' springs to mind. There are more ...

 

[TheParser]

what Should we do?


NOT A TEACHER


(1) I agree with the other posters that you should be consistent.

(2) I also most humbly and respectfully suggest that you concentrate on American

English.

(a) Of course, I do NOT know, but I suspect that most teachers of English throughout

the world teach American grammar, vocabulary, and spelling.

(b) If you are going into international business, you will probably (only a guess) find

that most business people who speak English as another language have chosen

American English. (For example, even a few (some?) British-English speakers have

suggested changing to American spelling. Let's be frank: there is simply no excuse to

spell "colour." The whole world is headed toward simplification in everything.)

 

[suprunp]

Let's be frank: there is simply no excuse to

spell "colour." The whole world is headed toward simplification in everything.)

May I ask you your opinion on the 'thru' spelling?

Thanks.

 

[SoothingDave]

Unless preceded by "Drive" and at the entrance to a fast food place, I would avoid it.

 

[TheParser]

May I ask you your opinion on the 'thru' spelling?

Thanks.

NOT A TEACHER


(1) Many years ago, an important newspaper publisher in Chicago tried to simplify

American spellings. One of his "inventions," I believe, was nite. Like many other

people, he thought that "night" was absurd. (I hear that MANY years ago, the

English people actually pronounced all the letters in "night.")

(2) Well, I am not sure, but maybe thru was also one of the words suggested

by that publisher. Here are a few comments:

(a) It is not used in formal writing.

(b) It is used in signs. Most notably at fast-food restaurants that offer

drive-thru windows. Many Americans drive their cars up to the window, order

their food, and leave -- never having had to get out of their cars!

(i) I think that thru is popular in signs because of its short length. I think that

many people would find drive-through as rather strange-looking.

(ii) I do not drive, but I think on the freeways there are signs that might

use thru, too.

(iii) Of course, I think that it would be ridiculous if you wrote:

Are you thru? (finished)

 

[Tdol]

(a) Of course, I do NOT know, but I suspect that most teachers of English throughout

the world teach American grammar, vocabulary, and spelling.

This depends very much on the area- American English is the dominant form in some areas, but not in others. In the EU, for instance, employment laws favour British and Irish teachers as they can work anywhere automatically, which squeezes the market for American teachers.

(b) If you are going into international business, you will probably (only a guess) find

that most business people who speak English as another language have chosen

American English.

Again, that depends on area- when I was teaching in universities in the UK, Chinese students started coming to learn BrE to do business in Europe.

(For example, even a few (some?)

British-English speakers have

suggested changing to American spelling. Let's be frank: there is simply no excuse to

spell "colour." The whole world is headed toward simplification in everything.)

I am in favour of this in theory, but changing over is like changing from imperial to metric- I tried for a few days to see how it would be and found the process frustrating. Although we have changed over officially to the metric system in the UK, I am stuck somewhere in the middle, and I think spelling reform may prove tricky in practice, though have nothing against the idea and would only have to change about six words in this post. ;-)

 

[SoothingDave]

I do not drive, but I think on the freeways there are signs that might

use thru, too.

Yes, good point. Thruway is OK, for example:

New York State Thruway Authority

 

[emsr2d2]

(a) Of course, I do NOT know, but I suspect that most teachers of English throughout

the world teach American grammar, vocabulary, and spelling.

It entirely depends on where you are, as someone else has said. In Madrid, for example, where I was teaching, the only people teaching American English were the American teachers. Because it's difficult for Americans to get a work permit in Europe, there are far more British and European teachers of English than anything else so the majority of learners are learning British English.

There is one huge English-teaching company in Spain run by an American guy but even they don't have many American teachers so I think the vast majority of their teachers are teaching British English too.


(For example, even a few (some?) British-English speakers have suggested changing to American spelling. Let's be frank: there is simply no excuse to spell "colour." The whole world is headed toward simplification in everything.)

For my part, I don't know anyone who wants us all to go over the simplifed American spelling of colour, honour etc. As far as I'm concerned, it's an anomaly like the -ise/-ize difference. Sometimes it even helps to work out where someone is from when all you have is their writing in front of you. If they've used the American spellings and variants, then they're probably American or have lived there for a long time.

The "excuse" for spelling it "colour" is that that is how it's spelt!

emsr2d2

 

[TheParser]

Again, that depends on area- when I was teaching in universities in the UK, Chinese students started coming to learn BrE to do business in Europe.



I am in favour of this in theory, but changing over is like changing from imperial to metric- I tried for a few days to see how it would be and found the process frustrating.


NOT A TEACHER


(1) I am astonished (and a bit hurt) to hear that Chinese students would want to learn

British English over American English. I had assumed (apparently quite wrongly) that

everyone in the world wants to imitate us.

(2) Yes, the metric system is going nowhere in the United States, at least for the

older generation. I mean, the words "inch," "foot," "yard" conjure up in my mind

real-life distances. The metric system is better in theory, but I guess it will be a while

before it really catches on. (Many immigrants in the U.S. are from metric countries,

so maybe they will speed up the process.)

 

[SoothingDave]

The metric system will be adopted by people where it is useful. Where it isn't, it never will be. Part of assimilation is adopting our measuring customs.

We buy milk by the gallon, for example. In Canada they buy it by a 4 liter container. Might as well call it a "metric gallon."

Celsius degrees will never be useful. They are too big.

 

[birdeen's call]

This depends very much on the area- American English is the dominant form in some areas, but not in others. In the EU, for instance, employment laws favour British and Irish teachers as they can work anywhere automatically, which squeezes the market for American teachers.

Even Polish English teachers teach mostly British English in Poland for many reasons, all of them stemming from one main reason: Great Britain is simply closer to us.

American English seems to be what self-learners tend to use. Those learn English mainly from the media.

 

[birdeen's call]

Celsius degrees will never be useful. They are too big.

Hmm... They're pretty useful to me. Don't you mean the kelvin?

 

[waflob]

What a can of worms TheParser has opened. Or will you be changing your name to TheTroller? ;-) (only kidding - don't change it !!).

I can't find the reference, but it is my understanding that Webster deliberately changed the spelling of certain words, not because of any linguistic advantages or formal correctness, but just to be different from England. At that time, USA had just won their hard independence from England and this was either the linguistic equivalent of placing his thumb on his nose and waggling his fingers, or some sort of fledgling identity thing - I'm not sure which.

tldr: 'color' is spelt like that, because 'colour' was already taken.

As to the various usages of 'thru', they all look like a systematic attempt to dumb down the language.

 

[SoothingDave]

Hmm... They're pretty useful to me. Don't you mean the kelvin?

No, I mean Celsius. When you adjust the thermostat on your house or your car's A/C, it moves in half degrees.

Why?

Because a degree C is too big of a shift.

It makes no sense for the normal range of human existence to be expressed on a scale of negative 15 to 35. There's not enough gradation there.

With Fahrenheit you get small numbers when it's cold, big numbers when it's hot. When it gets into the 90s, it's hot. 100 is a milestone. And when it gets below zero it is really cold.